Oh and important fact:
The judge stipulated that the fines CANNOT BE PAID VIA CAMPAIGN FUNDS.
Fat Ass can't run to his useful idiots. It has to be paid via assets and company funds.
#FIRE SALE FRIDAY!
this post was submitted on 16 Feb 2024
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But it can be paid by a PAC.
So basically the same thing.
His entire campaign raised ~$330M in 2016 election cycle. At the very least it's a massive hit to the funds they have to spend.
He's going to try to stiff the court. I'd bet money on it. He's going to hide behind his lawyers and try to claim the law doesn't apply the same way to an ex president. Just to delay long enough for the election.
The real test of our democracy will be whether or not they just arrest him when he tries that.
Not possible in this case, unless appeals court stays judgement then he's only got 30 days from now to pay up, or else the government can start seizing assets.
There's already a ban on transferring assets, and his businesses will have a court appointed monitor who will have the authority to review ALL payments the company makes. Also he can't cover the payment with loans from any bank or other financial institution registered in New York, which is most of them, lmao
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Uh, I don't think New York law provides for debtors' prisons anymore. Those went out of style in the 1700s.
The way a court actually handles an unpaid judgment is it just orders the seizure of any property the debtor does own. It doesn't need permission.
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Worth pointing out that there's interest on it until it's paid. Currently NY interest on judgements is 9%.
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But does that count as actual campaign funds or campaign funds + PAC money? Because the latter is the issue. PAC money can be spent however the PAC wants on whatever the PAC wants and PACs can also be funded with donations of any size (and by anyone from any country). Thanks, SCOTUS.
That's like four trillion rubles.
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I would rather he pay with campaign funds. I don't care how rich he is, I want him to fail in the 2024 election.
Three years? Are you shitting me?
For real, look at this shit
"Their complete lack of contrition and remorse borders on pathological. They are accused only of inflating asset values to make more money. The documents prove this over and over again. This is a venial sin, not a mortal sin. Defendants did not commit murder or arson. They did not rob a bank at gunpoint.
"Some will rob you with a six-gun, and some with a fountain pen," really great to see how far we've come since that was written
But I digress,
Donald Trump is not Bernard Madoff. Yet, defendants are incapable of admitting the error of their ways," Engoron wrote.
"Defendants’ refusal to admit error — indeed, to continue it, according to the Independent Monitor — constrains this Court to conclude that they will engage in it going forward unless judicially restrained," he added.
The ruling also bars the Trump sons — who've been running the company since their father went to the White House — “from serving as an officer or director of any New York corporation or other legal entity in New York for a period of two years.”
So, yeah, I guess the headline was shitting you, because at best it's going to be effectively a two year ban for this pack of pathologically remorseless creeps who the judge admits are definitely going to reoffend. Ain't justice grand? /s
Yeah, I really don't think people should be celebrating this. This is practically giving people permission to cheat on their taxes considering they still came out on top in terms of profiting overall.
I definitely understand wanting to celebrate, people have been waiting for this asshole to get what's coming to him since at least 2016
But yeah, this really isn't the death blow it could/should have been
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It could be a lifetime sentence!
Inshallah
That's what blows me away. It's not 3 years for being innocent, bc the judge assigned it for being GUILTY!?
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Why is it that people who commit fraud for less than $10,000 get jail for decades but commit fraud for millions and you only lose your ability to do business in a single state for 3 years?
Because 300m fine and lawyers?
I guarantee you Trump would pay way more than $300m if it meant dodging 10 years in prison.
Just because he has money (debatable) shouldn't mean he should get a pass where other people wouldn't.
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so that's nearly a HALF BILLION DOLLARS in fines owed to multiple entities by the (alleged) billionaire who is also the leading candidate to one political party.
now would be a real good time for that party to remove themselves from trump. because if they stay hitched to that wagon, they ain't winning shit. but the hilarious thing is that if they get behind haley right now they'll have an even shot at winning but she's so unappealing to the base they'll never do it.
it's great. 🤣😆🤣😆
I get denied from jobs with security clearances because I have student loans debt / financial hardships when they run background checks. The president has the ability to declassify any documents... And he has been on recording sharing classified documents with non clearanced individuals.
Security must only impact peasants
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Yeah no way is the base going to support a woman and especially one who doesn't kiss the ring.
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What's even funnier is initially the investigators were only looking to get $250M. During the case after a monitor was appointed, the Trump Org. started shuffling money around and they went after more money due to those actions.
trump's entire 2016 presidential campaign cost $340 million.
trump's 2020 campaign more then doubled that amount to spend $774 million(which, with his loss conveniently amounted to nothing).
This judgment, coupled with prejudgment interest, amounts to over $450 million.
And being barred from conducting business in New York is one heck of a cherry on top, although like many of you, I would have liked to see a lifetime ban.
His sons are also not allowed to have any role in Trump organizations in New York for 2 years and owe four million each.
There's trumps $83 million ruling for his rape and defamation of carroll as well.
Congrats, Letitia James and judge engoron.
Can't wait for the rest of these trials to get going.
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But if you grow weed you to prison for life. How are people ok with this?
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The judge also ordered that they pay substantial interest, pushing the penalty for the former president to $450 million, according to the attorney general, Letitia James.
That's gonna put a dent in the ol' reelection funds.
I can hear the donation emails and text messages getting typed up as we speak. You know them suckers are gonna pay too!
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So is this another OJ Simpson-type situation? Don't go to jail for what you did, just pay a fine for what you did? So no criminal consequences, but some civil ones for the same offense? I mean fraud must be a criminal offense in the US too, right?
This case involved charges of fraud made against Trump's company by the State of New York. This was a civil case, not a criminal case. The consequences were not supposed to be criminal.
The defamation lawsuits brought by E. Jean Carroll were also civil cases. She was not charging Trump with the crime of raping her many years ago; She was suing him (twice) for lying about whether he raped her many years ago. (She won both times.)
I think I get where you are coming from, though. When a person is rich enough to pay the fine, and also shameless enough to revel in the infamy of being found liable in a civil dispute, it can seem like that person doesn't end up suffering any significant consequence for their actions at all.
$355M is a lot of money. Add in the $83M owed to Carroll and these recent fines top $400M, which is an estimated amount of Trump's liquid assets. Trump is now likely running out of cash-on-hand, which could explain his recent takeover of the Republican National Committee -- the GOP's fundraising (and fund-spending) organization.
Criminal consequences come from criminal cases. Trump has invested most of his legal defense against the criminal cases he is facing. Pending criminal cases involving Trump include:
1.) A RICO ("Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations") case charged by the State of Georgia, against Trump and several others who allegedly conspired to steal the state's 16 electoral votes, including by having the President call (Republican) Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger and ask him to "find 11,780 votes" for him. Four people in that case have already accepted a plea deal. This case is currently delayed by a motion to disqualify the DA because she had a romantic relationship with a lawyer her office hired to help prosecute the case.
2.) A federal case against Trump for retaining classified documents. A year or so ago, it was found that former President Trump and former VP Mike Pence had kept classified documents after they left office, and that when Joe Biden left the office of VP in 2017, he also kept some classified documents. Both Pence and Biden complied with federal investigation and surrendered the documents immediately when asked. Unlike Pence and Biden, Trump did not comply with federal investigation, and instead took action to conceal the classified documents in his possession. This case is being heard in a Florida courtroom, because Trump was storing these stolen national secrets in a spare bathroom at Mar-A-Lago. The judge is a Trump appointee, and has demonstrated a tendency to rule in Trumps favor whenever she can, but if she shows too much bias she may get taken off the case.
3.) A federal case against Trump for his involvement in the insurrectionist attempt to disrupt the electoral vote count in congress on January 6, 2021. Trump has been indicted on four charges in this case: "conspiracy to defraud the United States; conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding; obstruction of and attempt to obstruct an official proceeding; and conspiracy against rights." Trump's defense has been that he has "absolute immunity" for any actions he took while serving as President. This claim of immunity has been denied and appealed multiple times. Trump has now asked the SCOTUS to hear his appeal, but they haven't said if they will yet. Until they do, that case is on hold, but there's no one else to appeal to higher than them. If SCOTUS chooses not to hear Trump's immunity appeal, the lower court's denial of it will stand and the case will go forward.
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Guy is gonna be 81 by the time the 3 year ban lifts, it's close enough to a lifetime ban.
It's great something has happened, but let's be honest if one of us peasants did the shit he did we'd be in jail for the rest of our lives.
So much winning!! /s
I like that last part where he's barred from running businesses in NY.
Will he actually have to pay this in any realistic time frame?
Or does he get to lodge a Supreme Court appeal that takes another 5 years to get a decision?
My understanding is that it must be paid in 30 days or, if he wants to appeal it, put into a trust or something. Effectively, removing his access to the money until the appeal is resolved.
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this is a state court decision. unless there is a federal issue to base an appeal on, scotus can't save him.
Yep. Notably, this specific law was designed for people exactly like Trump.
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Wow. He lucked out big time by not having the businesses claimed and broken up. That sucks.
The judgement is for 355M. How do you round off 55M?
Headline at NBC now says "more than $350 million". I imagine it was a typo earlier rushing to get the story posted.
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Somewhat like the Al Capone case, in that Capone was ultimately handled for tax evasion. Financial clamps can be the most successful.
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