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New Florida law requires city officials to disclose net worth; some are resigning instead (www.usatoday.com)

submitted 10 months ago by MicroWave to c/news

55 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Two Daytona Beach Shores city commissioners have resigned as the latest in a wave of local elected officials leaving before Jan. 1, when they face more stringent financial disclosure requirements.

Mel Lindauer, a Shores commissioner since 2016, told The News-Journal on Wednesday the new requirement − submitting what's known as Form 6 − is "totally invasive" and serves no purpose.

Commissioner Richard Bryan, who has also served since 2016, said in his Dec. 21 resignation letter that he had another priority but added the Form 6 issue "affected the timing" of his decision.

...

Many state officials already file a Form 6, including the governor and Cabinet, legislators, county council members and sheriffs. The forms require disclosure of the filer's net worth and holdings valued at more than $1,000, including bank accounts, stocks, retirement accounts, salary and dividends.

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[–] derf82 153 points 10 months ago (1 children)

"What difference does it make if one elected official is worth $100,000 and the other is worth $10 million?" he asked. "That's totally irrelevant."

Because I trust someone worth $100k or less to have my interests at heart far more than someone worth $10M. Do these people really not get that?

People are sick and tired of being ruled by the wealthy. The truth is, city government pay is often so bad, it’s only the wealthy with large passive income that will go for it.

[–] [email protected] 99 points 10 months ago (2 children)

It also shows who's accepting other money. If you're worth $10m but entered office with a lot less, the office doesn't pay enough for you to have earned all of that. You must have accepted ~~bribes~~ "donations" to get there.

[–] cogman 49 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Exactly this. Finance transparency should be a requirement for public officials. I honestly don't care if my politician has a NW of 10 million. I do care if that's tied to industries they are supposed to be regulating. I also care if they started out with nothing and became millionaires after joining politics.

That said, billionaires should be barred from ever interacting with politics. Congratulations, you won capitalism, now leave the rest of us alone.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago

City officials typically don't take bribes, they'll buy land after learning about a project, or select a company for a job that uses supplies from your company. One of the famous politicians in my area bought a bunch of land when a highway project was announced and made millions.

[–] Nerrad 115 points 10 months ago (3 children)

LOL. How in the world did this legislation get passed? In Florida, of all places.

[–] DigitalTraveler42 84 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Sen. Jason Brodeur, R-Sanford, sponsored the legislation in the Florida Senate. Rep. Spencer Roach, R-North Fort Myers, sponsored the House version of the bill and said it brings "parity" among elected officials.

Also sponsored by Republicans, voted for by a state Congress with a Republican super majority, I'd love to know what the catch is, but it's definitely a law that should be everywhere, public servants should always have transparency to prevent corruption and as the sponsor said "bring parity" to local elections.

[+] [email protected] 27 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

[deleted]

[–] [email protected] 15 points 10 months ago (2 children)

The law, for example, requires listing off every single asset you own that’s worth more than a thousand dollars. And punishment for errors is jailtime.

Absolutely obscene. Just thinking about my average apartment that would include 5 desktops, 2 phones, 2 tvs, couch, sundry jewelry, etc. Plus cars and other big ticket items. And I really don't have a lot of stuff outside my computer hobby. I'm almost certainly missing quite a few things, as well.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I also see room for creative interpretation.

That laptop might have been worth more and $1K a few years ago, but is it still? Probably not, but does the law make that distinction?

[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Yes, depreciation is a pretty standard thing.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 10 months ago

The law was written to specifically target city level officials (who are often Democrats) and includes jail time for any errors found during an audit.

The law specifically does not apply to state level officials (who are almost all Republican).

So it is an open question if depreciation is considered at all, because this law is not a Transparency Law, it's a "Punish Democrats we don't like with Jail" law.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Is that actually average in the US? I own not a single thing worth more than $1000 and I do have a job. I'm not trying to make a point or anything, just interesting to think how much people have.

[–] halcyoncmdr 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Many computers are going to be more than $1k, especially when talking about laptops that aren't shit hardware. Gaming desktops can easily move into the $3k tier now for high end systems, not even including other expensive components like gaming monitors which can be over $1k by themselves.

Then there's large quality TVs and home theater projectors. While a large TV can be purchased for fairly cheap now, there's a big difference in image quality and capability between a $500 TV and the $4k one sitting next to it even through they're the same size. TV technology has a pretty wide range now, it's no longer a simple question of resolution, size and maybe a couple simple panel categories like LCD or Plasma.

And for whatever reason flagship phones are in that range now as well. A new iPhone 15 Pro is $999, the 15 Pro Max is $1199. The Samsung Galaxy S23 and 23+ launched at the same price points. For the base capacity, without any upgrades.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 10 months ago

That's why I love my thriftiness! I have a gaming PC, not the nicest but it can run any modern games well enough at 1080p/60fps, it might be worth around 1000 but I've upgraded it slowly over years. I have no TV, I bike to work, I got my phone for 300 in 2019 and it still works great.

I looked into upgrading my phone recently, I can't even find a phone that has better hardware that I would want for a reasonable price, the only major improvement would be the camera, all other stats on mine are just as good or better than comparable new phones.

[–] DigitalTraveler42 7 points 10 months ago

I live in Florida too, just didn't see what the catch was in this one instance, but I've been paying attention to the Monique Worrell fuckery that DeSantis pulled to get her out of office over her political affiliation. There's been a whole lot of stupidly specific legislation to gain the Republicans meaningless or homophobic/racist political clout, my own in the closet state rep sponsored the anti-Drag show bill, while his wife hosts an event where pageant kids get sexualized. Overall the GOP are trying govern via legislation while doing all kinds of corrupt and inhumane shit like participating in sending migrants all over the country with our tax dollars, yet next election these idiots will keep them in office while they continue to not improve the state for anyone but the rich, white, and Christian.

[–] Meltrax 15 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The catch is that it applies to city officials, not state or national level. So, not to any of the Republicans who sponsored or supported it.

[–] danl 14 points 10 months ago

Nah. It already applies to everyone else - this is maybe just about limiting the pool of challengers.

From the Florida Government site :

Who Must File Form 6: All persons holding the following positions: Governor, Lieutenant Governor, Cabinet members, members of the Legislature, State Attorneys, Public Defenders, Clerks of Circuit Courts, Sheriffs, Tax Collectors, Property Appraisers, Supervisors of Elections, County Commissioners, elected Superintendents of Schools, members of District School Boards, Mayor and members of the Jacksonville City Council, Judges of Compensation Claims; the Duval County Superintendent of Schools, and members of the Florida Housing Finance Corporation Board, each expressway authority, transportation authority (except the Jacksonville Transportation Authority), bridge authority, toll authority, or expressway agency created pursuant to Chapter 348 or 343, F.S., or any other general law, and judges, as required by Canon 6, Code of Judicial Conduct.

[–] reversebananimals 18 points 10 months ago

I'm surprised too but it sounds like its working as intended!

[–] takeda 10 points 10 months ago

I was about to say that finally something good is coming from the state. Got used to disappointing headlines.

[–] [email protected] 101 points 10 months ago (3 children)

Meanwhile in Norway every citizen can look up any other person's tax returns. Income and fortune all neatly presented on a government website.

[–] [email protected] 58 points 10 months ago (2 children)

I just today learned that Finland does this as well. It took a while to consider, but it would help people to get paid fair wages, detect corruption, and to generally ensure people are more honest about their finances. Overall, it's a very different approach to what it means to be in a society together.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I think this works much better in society with low inequality, or maybe for ones that got rid of most robbers, scammers, and fraudsters. But then again, maybe Finland and Norway are good in that regard and that's great then.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

And by 'works much better' you mean: there won't be country-wide outrage, I assume? I think it's actually meant to bring to light inequalities, awkward as it may be.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 10 months ago

No, I meant less targeted robbing and burglary, and people that can rest peacefully knowing that they earn pretty much the same amount as their neighbour

[–] [email protected] 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Privacy is by and large the tool of the powerful to abuse power and privilege.

[–] Hardeehar 1 points 10 months ago

This swings both ways. Public information such as voting records, for example, were used to coerce, intimidate, and physically hurt innocent people in the past. I think it takes a mature culture/society to use public information responsibly and I don't think we are there yet.

Then again, a ton of awful stuff happens in private already, so there needs to be a balance of some kind.

[–] FlyingSquid 40 points 10 months ago (7 children)

This sounded like a bad idea to me, but I can't actually come up with a reason why, so maybe it's not.

[–] GladiusB 17 points 10 months ago

I can see why people would not like it from a privacy standpoint. It would never fly in America for everyone. For government officials? I like this one.

[–] Keineanung 14 points 10 months ago

Had the exact same thought process.

[–] jantin 14 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The reason is it's like a treasure map with multiple "x"-es for any burglar. While in the Nordics it's not that much of a problem (though I did read once or twice stories of people who were repeatedly and uniquely targeted because they were somewhat richer than their neighbours and despite not showing off), in any country with a large, unsupported poor population and limited to none public trust...

[–] [email protected] 23 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (9 children)

It's almost like places with honest and open financial records like that have policies that support less income equality and therefore less thieves exist there. What a concept.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago

Because you see it from your personal point of view. Seeing it from a government perspective it’s public money and should be easily identified. Also if I remember correctly, in Norway you have to identify yourself to get access to the data.

[–] havokdj 3 points 10 months ago

Because it could potentially subject you to a planned robbery? That's about it, although I think it definitely depends on the place too. Norway likely doesn't have to worry about that issue.

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[–] themeatbridge 8 points 10 months ago

I'm in favor of transparency, but this sounds like it was designed to put democrats in prison.

It only applies to city officials, not county or state, (more likely to be democrats) and has stiff penalties for any errors discovered during an audit.

[–] Boozilla 76 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Every level of government should require this, IMO.

If folks want to resign over it, I get it, and that's fine. You are meant to be replaced regularly anyway. Career politicians are more of a bug than a feature.

If you don't want people to know your finances, you shouldn't be a public servant. Power should include transparency.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

There's only one problem: Until it's a requirement on every level it shouldn't be one for single levels.

This law is not a tool for transparency, but a weapon for state politicians against local politicians disagreeing with them.

What we have here is a law in a majorily red state that does not apply for state officials (republicans) but does apply for local politicians (democrats in several big cities) that can punish minor infractions (please try to make a list of everything you own with the correct values that can withstand an audit by the state...) with jail time. Go figure...

[–] AA5B 19 points 10 months ago

Many state officials already file a Form 6, including the governor and Cabinet, legislators, county council members and sheriffs.

[–] Boozilla 6 points 10 months ago

Thanks for the context, that certainly changes my view of it. Sounds like the usual "rules for thee, not for me" dick move.

[–] [email protected] 48 points 10 months ago

I am surprised they even passed that law. For Floridian standards, this is good and the bar isn't even high 😂

[–] Chessmasterrex 20 points 10 months ago

The one's resigning are the people that shouldn't be in office. It's likely a great benefit to Florida that they're gone.

[–] JokeDeity 16 points 10 months ago

Hmmm, 2016... Did something else happen around that time that may have emboldened certain people with certain idealogies to get into positions of power?

[–] fne8w2ah 15 points 10 months ago

Corrupt Florida men and women fecking off from positions of power they shouldn't deserve.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago

I might resign too. But in my case it would be because I didn't want to quantify how little my life has amounted to.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

People are afraid of others knowing how much money they make. Either out of pride or shame, or out of fear that something out of place may be discovered.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 10 months ago

Some quick looking doesn't reveal the political affiliations of either Lindauer or Bryan.

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