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All communities included on the sidebar are to be made in compliance with the instance rules. Striker
Remindes me of the tweet that said something like "My favorite moment on the internet was when someone said, they believe that people will changed their mind when given evidence. Then I linked TWO SOURCES that said otherwise and they were like I still believe it."
Or when a hexbearian explained to me that hexbear isn't toxic at all, it's just when people refuse to read sources but than it's their fault for not engaging with the material. Later they refused to open my sources.
Ya got a source for that?
/s
Good that they didn't change their mind. If they had, you'd have been in trouble because your sources said otherwise.
The person you're talking to is unlikely to be pursuaded but there's usually silent, invisible lurkers who can be.
I know I've changed my mind on things because of arguments I've read on the internet.
It is proven that people do double down on their views when confronted with opposing evidence, but IMO this is more about the psychology of trust and confrontation between individuals, rather than proof of the futility of argument as a concept. Hell, Vsauce made a video called 'The Future of Reasoning', where he makes the case that argument might have been selected for as an essential part of human psychology and necessary for our survivial.
True. Sometimes it takes more than one random person on the internet to convince you but they might be part of starting a thought process.
Wether it's on the internet or at a bar counter, I like to engage in debate to better myself. If your goal is to turn every fanatic that crosses your path, you're gonna be depressed real soon.
If your goal in an argument is to change the other person's mind, then changing your mind (by taking in new information, learning, and understanding a different point of view) is seen as losing. That's a terrible way to look at what is ultimately personal growth.
Love this, thank you.
There's no hope in changing the mind of every fanatic you come across.
But we generally don't have internet debates in DMs, we do it in public forums. The goal isn't to sway the fanatics, it's to publicly quash their arguments. To sway curious onlookers away from fanaticism before they become fanatics themselves.
People always forget about the lurkers. Most people with less-informed, more impressionable views on a given topic aren’t posting and debating, they’re reading and learning (despite the unfortunate exceptions). Seeing some wacko extremist nonsense or voter suppression tactic go unchallenged by a more reasonable argument may be enough to sway a not-yet-fanatic in the wrong direction.
One of the most refreshing things I've seen since joining Lemmy is people actually apologizing in comment threads like this.
I'm sorry to hear that! Don't worry, it'll get better as more people join, just you wait!
Wait, you mean internet arguments aren't a game of chicken where the winner is whoever gets the last reply?
Challenge accepted.
No you're wrong. It's a game of votes, whoever gets the most votes is the most correct.
No they don't
Well actually they do.
According to this trusted source.
Nuh-uh
Your facts are meaningless to me, a guy with an opinion.
Now I get angry and make hurtful accusations about you.
I'm not reading that.
👋 Me. I clicked it.
I'm in 10 levels of clicking it, when will I finally be able to read the details of it?
It's trusted sources all the way down.
That sounds like the words of someone who quits right before they change the other person's mind
You don't realize that you're wrong in the moment. The idea bounces around in your head long enough for your brain to decide it was your own conclusion. We can become less biased, but make no mistake: our brains are a total mess.
This is what happens when evolution throws hardware at a problem, succeeds, and it's still poorly optimized.
Realizing you're wrong while you're still tilted is the weirdest feeling.
I've definitely changed my mind on a few things as a result of online discussions. I can't remember specifically what the topics were, unfortunately. What I do remember is that it didn't happen the moment of the disagreement. It was a few days later when the topic came back up for unrated reasons and I realized I had the other opinion.
The trick is to argue with the voices in your own head and simply project them on to other people's comments.
i cannot express how much i hate that, why must people keep imagining points and opinions i never said or made
Gabagool was the most important story arc in the Sopranos, change my view.
I don't argue to make them change their mind, I argue to make them angry >:)
Oh goodness, I should hope not! I love arguing on the internet, and I would hate to think that I'm actually changing peoples minds.
The last few years had made me lose all respect for debates as a field of study. Remembering shit like logos and pathos and all that nonsense for nothing.
Sir, this is the internet, nobody is allowed to quit
Nuh-uh
I know this is just a joke, but I'm reading a book on quitting right now and one of the points she is driving home is that if you quit at the right time, it tends to feel too early to quit.
How to differentiate it from actually quitting too early?
It feels too early. The idea is that you have to recognize your own cognitive and social biases that make us want to persist and objectively determine whether it makes sense to go on.
People don't change their mind so easily...
Nuh-uh, not me. I stop long before they change their mind.