this post was submitted on 28 Jan 2024
577 points (99.1% liked)

Technology

59670 readers
3936 users here now

This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.


Our Rules


  1. Follow the lemmy.world rules.
  2. Only tech related content.
  3. Be excellent to each another!
  4. Mod approved content bots can post up to 10 articles per day.
  5. Threads asking for personal tech support may be deleted.
  6. Politics threads may be removed.
  7. No memes allowed as posts, OK to post as comments.
  8. Only approved bots from the list below, to ask if your bot can be added please contact us.
  9. Check for duplicates before posting, duplicates may be removed

Approved Bots


founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] flop_leash_973 108 points 10 months ago (15 children)

This sort of thing is why I dislike legislation that mandates the use of something very specific. Things change and it is better to create laws that don’t become outdated as fast as tech tends to.

[–] [email protected] 76 points 10 months ago

That's a Japan thing and a legislative failure.

What normally happens in most countries is the law would say something vague like "digital means or devices such as floppy disks or equivalent".
Then the Executive makes and maintains the rules of application of that law according to the Hierarchy of Norms (things probably are organized differently in Common Law countries so I don't know the English term but the principle is the same), which dictates in more detail how the law is to be applied ("please use a web form, or a USB keys for legacy processes").

Sometimes the executive lags behind a bit but typically it's just a ministry making decisions within the margin of the law, so it's not too bad.

[–] [email protected] 29 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Without it we get a different iPhone charger every year that no other device is allowing to use

[–] [email protected] 8 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (3 children)

It’s just a brick with a USB socket. I still have 5W usb chargers from iPhones a decade ago that work with anything USB.

They didn’t change connectors on the cables frequently either. The old big one, lightning, and USB C are the only connectors iPhone used.

load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] maness300 19 points 10 months ago (1 children)

It's an argument of centralization vs. decentralization and there are pros and cons to each approach.

[–] homesweethomeMrL 17 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Hey, hey - you’re going to have to hotten up that take there, Bubba.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (12 replies)
[–] AlmightySnoo 103 points 10 months ago (2 children)

If the 1.44MB DS/HD floppies are too modern for your gear, 720MB DS/DD media is also available (for a premium).

they probably meant 720KB there

[–] [email protected] 27 points 10 months ago

I hear data in Japan is smaller and efficiently organized.

[–] AnUnusualRelic 11 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Are you snubbing 8" floppies just because they don't fit in your pocket?

[–] blanketswithsmallpox 10 points 10 months ago

Is that a floppie in your pocket or are you just happy to see me?

[–] [email protected] 54 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Ah man the translucent colourful floppies.. that takes me back

[–] [email protected] 19 points 10 months ago (1 children)

It was a happier time, I miss my atomic purple floppies.

I rewrote that several times because I have the mind of a child, but atomic purple 3.5” was even worse so I give up and you get to enjoy both.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 12 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I still have some somewhere. One even says "DOOM" on it, of course.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] Coreidan 54 points 10 months ago (5 children)

What in the hell are they using them for? They hold so little data I don’t see how they can even be practical at this point.

[–] kuneho 35 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

where I live (not Japan), trams are updated with a suitcase worth of floppy disks (and these are the more modern trams here)

[–] bfg9k 30 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Older Boeing's use floppies to update their flight computer data even today

[–] [email protected] 19 points 10 months ago (1 children)

And Boeing is obviously trustworthy when it comes to maintenance.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 months ago

ones with floppies are alright, beware modern ones.

[–] Emerald 12 points 10 months ago (6 children)

if it aint broke dont fix it. That door plug on the other hand

load more comments (6 replies)
[–] [email protected] 18 points 10 months ago (1 children)

One thing came to mind, Irreplaceable infrastructure computer systems from decades ago.

There are powerplants and oil rigs that use computer from decades ago which is irreplaceable (either due to technical or cost effective).

[–] [email protected] 15 points 10 months ago (1 children)

either due to technical or cost effective

Mainly due to proprietary hardware+software solutions which cannot be ported now and remaking them with new hardware will require redoing the same processes as before (probably with additional stuff added by later laws) all over again.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago (1 children)

If you try to replace just the hardware, you get fun solutions like a modern computer with a VM running Dosbox on critical infrastructure. Hey, if it works and your boss is willing to sign off on it...

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago (8 children)

10 to one they weren't, look how oddly this article is phrased. I'd guess there was a rule government offices had to accept floppy discs, have the equipment to read them, but the clients weren't actually submitting that way anymore.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

Like, the first paragraph explains.

Until last week there were about 1,900 official governmental application procedures that stipulated businesses must submit floppies or CD-ROMs (specifically) containing supplementary data.

Not "the government had to accept them", but "businesses were required to submit them".

It's not a hypothetical problem, there was even news a few years ago about how businesses were complaining they had to send in a dozen+ disks at a time because of file formats.

The laws were written at the dawn of the digital age, in the 70s and 80s, stipulating specific storage media, and just never got updated because the government didn't view it as a problem.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (7 replies)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 months ago

Their government agencies still used a lot of them.

[–] [email protected] 47 points 10 months ago (4 children)

Yes, but can I still submit using a fax machine?

[–] [email protected] 42 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Sure, that's never going. Why would we want to lose our technological connection to Abraham Lincoln and samurai?

[–] [email protected] 15 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I love that this is literally accurate.

[–] asbestos 6 points 10 months ago (5 children)
load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 28 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Healthcare worker, chiming in:

Yes please.

[–] [email protected] 30 points 10 months ago (4 children)

Ah yes, just how sensitive information should be sent. In clear text over the internet.

[–] SpaceNoodle 15 points 10 months ago (4 children)

It's not in clear text, you have to use a decent OCR

load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[–] FlyingSquid 6 points 10 months ago (1 children)
load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 40 points 10 months ago

Japan has been living in the year 2000 for 40 years

[–] Mango 17 points 10 months ago (3 children)

How do you force someone to use them?

[–] [email protected] 63 points 10 months ago (1 children)

FTA:

Japan’s Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry has abolished any requirement for applicants to use this ancient clicking and buzzing magnetic media when filing official documents. Until last week there were about 1,900 official governmental application procedures that stipulated businesses must submit floppies or CD-ROMs (specifically) containing supplementary data.

[–] Mango 28 points 10 months ago

Oh, just government.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 10 months ago

Open and close the metal shutter on the disk in their general direction to assert dominance

[–] aeronmelon 9 points 10 months ago (3 children)

You tie them to the desk and withhold food and water until they reformat an entire box of Mac floppies for use in Windows.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

Fuckin' dumbfuck 3rd grade teacher having us all do class assignments in a lab full of Macs, saving our work on Mac formatted disks, and then expecting us to also work on it at home on our parent's Compaqs/IBMs.

Sorry, just had a core memory unlocked.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[–] raynethackery 7 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

I wonder if this will affect the vintage computer enthusiasts?

[–] [email protected] 14 points 10 months ago (1 children)

They're not banning floppies lol, they're just not required for submitting things to the government anymore.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I imagine such a huge drop in demand would probably lead to any still standing manufacturers to cease production though.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The last manufacturers stopped making them 10 years ago. There's basically just one guy "making" floppies these days, and he doesn't actually manufacture them, he just buys used ones for pennies on the dollar, formats and tests them, and sells them on. Not one company has made new floppies in a decade. A shocking number of industries are dependant on just like, this one random dude.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments
view more: next ›