Has YouTube experienced enshittification?
It seems like some websites think that the more the users know about the quality of the content, the worse it is for the website’s profit
this post was submitted on 29 Oct 2024
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Enshittification
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What is enshittification?
The phenomenon of online platforms gradually degrading the quality of their services, often by promoting advertisements and sponsored content, in order to increase profits. (Cory Doctorow, 2022, extracted from Wikitionary) source
The lifecycle of Big Internet
We discuss how predatory big tech platforms live and die by luring people in and then decaying for profit.
Embrace, extend and extinguish
We also discuss how naturally open technologies like the Fediverse can be susceptible to corporate takeovers, rugpulls and subsequent enshittification.
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It means they can shovel whatever bullshit they want without you realizing it is not an algorithm but a manual selection of videos.
I don't even mind view count, but why would they even remove upload date? That's the only way to know whether the video is new or not.
Youtube wants to own what you watch. Thats why they pivot so hard from showing you the subscriber list first and want to bank on their own algorithm to choose what you see.
Once they do, they have a captured audience of millions they get to choose what you think, buy, see ads for and become addicted too.
because if you don’t know straight away how old the video is, now you have to click on it to see. bam, ads.
Yeah, particularly great when i want to see some creators take/analysis/lecture on recent events, that are subject to daily changes.
Great way to muddy the water for people following the war in Ukraine.
Most likely answer is that they do it for the same reason as Facebook not sorting their feed by date: they want users to fully rely on their algorithm. My completely uneducated guess is that they want to feed their users older videos where they don't pay out as much to their creators as they do for new videos.
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Taking away information so I can't choose how best to use my time... yeah fuck that enshittification.
The lack of upload date is the thing that already bugs me the most about YouTube Shorts. Well, maybe the second most after the entire concept.
YouTube Shorts have a description, which has the upload date at the top. Though this doesn't show up when searching for Shorts, or having them in your feed.
I can’t stand YouTube’s feed. It’s so bad. This does not help. I know many others already said it, but this is not an improvement.
The date can matter a lot. Especially, when it comes to tech learning. That world moves too fast. If you’re learning programming on YouTube, you need to be sure you have current info.
I desperately with YouTube had real competition.
The date can matter a lot.
The original algorithm rewarded engagement absent dates, but this resulted in old classic hits mopping up revenue while newer stuff struggled to grab anyone's attention. You'll never make a music video more popular than Rick Astley's Never Gonna Give You Up, so why bother trying?
Then the algorithm shifted to fresh-first bias, which incentivized streamers to constantly churn out new content. But it still contended with users who stubbornly wanted to see the old content. So you got a bunch of content that tried to imitate historical hits or play on trends. This ended up producing 10,000 videos named some variation of "Rick Astley's Never Gonna Give You Up, Explained" with a digitally edited picture of the singer with big eyes and a soy face.
Now we've got this deluge of AI generated crap that nobody wants to look at or search for, piling up in YouTube's back catalog. The only way to justify hosting it is to jam it into someone's feed. So every user is being A/B Tested once again, with a new procedurally generated wall of garbage that will eventually narrow down what any given individual is most likely to click on and watch. Then we can solve both of the problems above. Always have new content, but its technically "fresh" rather than a rehash of some prior release.
We are doing Monkeys On Typewriters because someone at YouTube HQ decided it was better than letting anyone watch the Rick Astley video one more time.
I desperately with YouTube had real competition.
There are other places to host video, but they tend to be very boutique or with an abundance of very low quality content. That, plus YouTube leveraging economies of scale and the networking effect means there's nowhere else you'd ever want to try and host a video, unless you were looking to reach a very boutique audience or you were putting out material you didn't really expect anyone to watch.
So I just installed Linux on a new computer and during the short install I went to YouTube for something but it didn't even give me a list of videos to watch instead it told me I had to search so it can build a list of videos to recommend.
I'm not sure if this is a new change or what but along with this and taking away information I'm ready to just drop YouTube altogether probably better for my health... There is one service that was created by the people who do jetlag I might give them a try at this point.
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Isn't YT the poster child of enshittification?
Facebook set the bar high, but Google is rising to the challenge.
Well, time to install two new add-ons: Return YouTube View Counts and Return YouTube Upload Dates.
Somebody please make those.
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Sometimes I watch videos of The Daily Show and it drives me bonkers that they upload old episodes from a decade ago and it's impossible to tell if it's current Daily Show, or the classic one. If the whole service was like that... I'm completely gone.
Yeah, same with outdated tutorials, old news etc.
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I guess they really want to get rid of users huh.
I watch tech videos. If I can't see when a video is from, I'm not going to waste my time on watching it.
Conspiracy time: Google is purposely making their video platform worse because they're sacrificing it for a tax loss in 5 years when they shut it down. In those five years they're going to "ramp up" development and write off all that "work" to pay for other projects.
Their UX and design choices are amateur at best and clearly they have no interest in maintaining the product(much like all of their retired line).
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Why the fuck would they even think of doing that? Genuinely what is the purpose? How does it benefit them?
You might (rightly) skip videos many years old that are no longer relevant. Without the date info available to you, you won't know they contain out-of-date useless information, and might watch them (generating more views and ad revenue).
The goal is to make you click and anything that could stop you is considered a problem. I'd say it's a short term strategy that will lead to long term failure but I'm not sure anymore. Tiktok and Instagram are feeding their users a bunch of trash too and it still works.
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Return YouTube dislikes will change to
Return YouTube dislikes + view count + upload date
Until they shut down / lock down the APIs that allow querying this information.
What would removing the dates accomplish except making things more confusing and harder to find? What advantage to YouTube is there?
My guess is that it makes it easier to suggest you older content that wouldn't be interesting when you can see at a glance how outdated it is.
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YouTube's goal, as was Facebook and Instagram and Twitter and TikTok and everyone else, is to get you to consume what they want you to consume, rather than what you choose to consume.
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The optimist in me hopes this will be used to give smaller channels a push in views and attention, even years later, when they may have been skipped over or ignored previously.
The realist in me knows this will be used to push garbage that would otherwise be self-filtered by users due to the red flags of dates/views.
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view counts, I'm okay with. I do want to see how old a video is and how long a video is.
I watch niche stuff on Youtube. I watched a guy copy an old ISA adapter card for the very first CD-ROM drive. That's not gonna do BeasTiePie numbers, and I don't care. It isn't information I use to select a video. I think it's useful information to have generally available, but I don't necessarily need it on the home screen. It should maybe be displayed on a channel's Videos page, where there's more screen real estate per video, and in the video's description header.
Date uploaded is pertinent information. Is this a recent entry in a series I enjoy? Is this breaking or old news? Has ANOTHER 10,000 people died in a hurricane or is this just a month old? Is this from before ThE iNcIdEnT, or after?
Why do you think they are getting rid of the date of upload? UX reasons? No, they want to be able to serve you the same video, especially for news. Generates more clicks when you need to check if something is a year old or not.
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If the video is about an ongoing event, say the Titan submarine disaster, I'd rather watch videos posted last week them videos posted a year ago, because the new info makes the old content irrelevant.
If a search for videos about how to perform carbon fiber layups shows one with 1.2m views in the last year and another with 5k views from the past 6 years, I will probably watch the better performing video first.
But if I want to see a video about some esoteric subject like how the bathyscaphe triste worked, that isn't really changing much, I don't care about post date or view count.
Date is relevant information. I need it as part of my decision-making. Same as choosing between videos with 12 views and those with 10k views. It's not everything, but it's part of the equation. Let me fucking choose.
Has YouTube experienced enshittification?
Ummm, only for the past decade?
Youtube is getting shittier by the minute. Come to think of it, many things are.
Hopefully they'll remove the length, the channel name, the thumbnail, the title and the entire video, too.
Date is how I go by whether or not someone I'm interested in has put up a new video or if YouTube is just showing me an old one I forgot about.
So I'm finally going to have to start fucking subscribing?
Ugh.
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For fucks sake. This will do wonders for video tutorials and won't backfire in any way due to the content being outdated /s
The removal of view counts could empower fringe content. Even the most gullible are far less likely to take a video of an extremist nut job seriously when they have 100 views. Part of how radicalisation works is by convincing people that the radical ideology is far more mainstream than it actually is. It's already easy to inflate view counts but removing them entirely makes it much much simpler for crazies to sell the idea that their ideas are popular.
Wow, your algorithm shows the exact same videos that mine does. I've never seen that before. Every time I check out someone else's YouTube, their homepage is completely different from mine.
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I've been using https://freetubeapp.io/ client for a few months and am extremely happy with it. It allows me to subscribe to channels without requiring an account, it has a nice UI that doesn't shove videos I don't care about in my face, no ads, can download videos, and it's in general a way better experience. Haven't used web YT in ages.
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Side note:
I like to do a semi-anual audit of the information sources I use, and last year I removed the infographics channel from my feed. It turns out it's a content farm that puts quantity over quality. Some of their videos may actually be good, but they don't have the fact checking safeguards that more reliable channels like kurzgesagt does.
You'll notice Kurzgesagt has several videos that delve into how they do their research, and how the funds they receive from individuals, governments, and corporations affect their videos. Check to see if any of your channels have a "how we make our content" page. If they don't, it's for a reason.
Also, be wary of channels that use the kurzgesagt visual style, or an aesthetic that is similar to a notably trusted source. I've noticed a lot of false info that has an easier time being passed off as good due to using animation that we might associate with quality educational content.
Joke's on them, I got used to my homepage being "fuck you for disabling search history" for years
It's because users are less likely to watch old videos. They do this on TikTok. You'll see videos that are years old on your feed because they have a lack of new content. You watch the new videos and then move on with your day. Now you're getting shown more videos and more likely to stay.
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Well... One more reason to ditch YouTube. As always: Reminder PeerTube exists.
I know the network effect is powerful, but YouTube won't lose until people are fed up enough to not use it.
I watched a creator having a meltdown today, because his views stats weren't seeming correct, nor his monetary compensation.
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