this post was submitted on 24 Jul 2023
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Hold on tight, we are almost back...

Previously on Lemmy: Sony

Past Discussions:

I thought we should restart the brand discussion with something more popular to give this community relaunch a bit more oomph. So, Samsung it is.

I've never really used a Samsung phone much before, despite them being so popular in the States. Have friends who used them, they usually look nice and high quality, and the Galaxy S Active are the only high-end phones I know that doesn't shatter when you look at them wrong without a case, so, props to Samsung.

There are may reasons I don't like Samsung phones: Hardware fuse disabling Knox on bootloader unlock, Exynos vs Snapdragon models, the mandatory Bixby button, the Galaxy Note 7 that really blew up. To me, Samsung phones are trying so hard to go against what makes Android good, which is the customizability to do whatever you wanted. Android is everything; Samsung is just Samsung.

Personally, I think Samsung is only worth buying at the very high end for the Galaxy S series. I've heard that A series have gotten better, but there always seems to be better choices from Moto/Pixel/Chinese brands on Amazon that it's not worth considering their low tier offering.

What should we do next week? I'm thinking Microsoft, just to make fun of them for the very idea of making a Surface Duo 2.

FAQ:

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[–] Willifire 54 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Hardware great, software garbage. They really want to be like Apple but aren't even half as competent (which is more an insult to Samsung than praise to Apple). It comes bloated with all kind of garbage alot of which you can't uninstall (like Facebook). They have their own app store next to the Google Store which is annoying. It has no reason to be there other than distributing their shitty apps that I don't want in the first place.

I currently have an S21 and can't wait to have the spare income to replace it.

[–] kenblu24 20 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Facebook does not come on their unlocked phones. I've set up my S8 and S23, as well as Note 9 and Note 22 for family and none of them came with bloatware aside from Samsung's apps. However I got a used Galaxy tablet on AT&T and it had so much crap on it. At least it's removable using ADB.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago (1 children)

It does however include meta services, meta app manager, and meta app installer which you have to either disable after enabling view of system apps or use adb to remove it.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago

Fun fact, the Meta installer is a system app so it can quietly install (also system) stuff without your knowledge.

Also, having seen what extensive spying a regular Facebook app does (when it's a non-system app!) I wouldn't touch a Samsung phone without root with a ten foot pole.

[–] MargotRobbie 14 points 1 year ago

Bold of them to assume people who buy expensive Android phones still use Facebook in 2023.

[–] idunnololz 7 points 1 year ago

I bought a Samsung phone years ago and had to return it. I remember feeling really conflicted when I decided to return it. Hardware wise it was the best there was at the time and the phone itself looked beautiful. On paper it was a monster. Yet it dropped frames like crazy and stuttered doing the most basic tasks. I just couldn't justify spending that much money for a mediocre experience. Such a pity.

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[–] Reliant1087 29 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Samsung has great hardware but my OG galaxy S2 was peak Samsung for me. I still love their build quality but I don't like curved screens, lack of sd slots and 3.5mm jack and so on. Neither do I want all the Samsung social etc. apps.

If Samsung made a clean phone like the pixel with their build quality, that would be a game changer.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

It would be interesting for the users but it would also undermine Samsung's position in their war with Google.

The reason Samsung duplicates all the apps etc. is so that they keep Google at arm's length. Google controls their manufacturers with tightly controlled deals for the Android trademark and access to the Play Store and Services Framework. By duplicating those and the app ecosystem, Samsung is saying "we won't be so easy to get rid of".

Granted, Samsung is also the largest Android manufacturer, so all out war would probably mean the fracture of the entire Android landscape.

I've once read a comparison between the income percentage that Android represents for Samsung and Google respectively and I seem to recall it would damage Google more than Samsung. But it was years ago so that might have changed, and also the Google side analysis involved guesswork about the impact on their ad and data collection business.

[–] Reliant1087 7 points 1 year ago

I don't mind the phone/contacts/dialer etc. They seem pretty functional most of the time. I hate my phone being loaded with AR Emoji, Samsung sync and a bunch of other stuff that should either be opt in or allowed to be uninstalled.

What pisses me off even more is that despite all this junk, they can't be arsed to develop a proper audio player or Equalizer.

Whatever their position is, I paid more than a reasonable amount of money for this phone and I should be able to use it how I want to. I appreciate the fact that I can install graphene or calyxos on my pixel 5a and resign the bootloader while you can't touch a single thing without tripping Knox on my note 9.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Woah... i learned something new today

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[–] AlphaOmega 29 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Samsung phones have great hardware, but all the Samsung bloatware ruins the phone. Good if you can get one with only stock android

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (2 children)

The only good thing about Samsung's software is Dex which unfortunately has no decent replacement.

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[–] rDrDr 23 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Samsung phones are the worst android phones you can buy, except for all the others.

As frustrating as Samsung is, I always find myself going back to them. Displays, build quality, cameras, performance, storage capacity, speakers, software features (Dex!), they're just ahead of the curve across the board.

The only legitimate advantage of Chinese phones is the super fast charging, but I'm in the better safe than sorry camp on that one.

I've had the Fold 3 and now Fold 4, and I really don't see myself getting anything other than a Fold 6 down the line, unless something major changes.

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[–] lazycouchpotato 19 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

Mixed opinions.

Things I like about Samsung:

  • Feature-rich hardware and software
  • 4 years of OS updates compared to 3 by Google
  • S Pen in Note/Ultra
  • Foldables
  • Keeping Android tablets and Android-compatible smartwatches alive when Google abandoned them. Huge props for that.

Things I dislike:

  • Making fun of Apple and then doing the exact same things they did: removing the headphone jack, display notch, removing the charger in the box.
    • They even got rid of expandable storage in the S series despite being a major manufacturer of micro SDs.
  • Samsung's software is notorious for being slow, generally inferior compared to Google's and not the most well-designed out there.
    • I tried both the Galaxy A52 and a Pixel 6a at Best Buy. The A52 was lagging. I bought the 6a.
  • They're edging towards anti-repair.
  • Certain Samsung smartwatch features only work if you have a Samsung phone.
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[–] IronRain 19 points 1 year ago (3 children)

As someone who exclusively used Samsung flagships as their daily driver (GS2 > Note 4 > Note 8 > Note 20 Ultra), I was a Samsung absolutist and fanboy. But their decisions since the N20U has been frustrating, and has had me eyeing other brands for the first time.

To start about what I love about them: fantastic hardware with solid software. I don't mind their excessive features, because they become so useful, Android/Google adds them to stock 2-3 years later. So it's like a decent beta test for some awesome utilities, like saying "smile" to take a photo with the camera when you can't reach the shutter button. I think several phones now offer this.

What has me eyeing something else for my next phone: shitting on their hardcore power users and greedily taking away options. The removal of the SD card (critical for my usage), the dilution of their features across different models (base, plus, ultra), removing the magstripe, etc. are all anti-consumer with NO benefit to their customers. Even if your typical customer doesn't use a specific feature, it strips the option away from those who do, and it's not like the savings go towards the consumer. If not for these decisions (among other, smaller infractions), I wouldn't be contemplating other brands.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago (4 children)

I'm going to jump to Samsung's defense here as I think your anti-consumer belief is misguided:

  • the SD card has been drifting away from most Android phones for the core reason of reliability. Data stored on SD cards is not at reliable and when apps are forced to run off the SD card, there are side effects and crashes which are nightmares for devs. When a non brand SD card loses a user's data, the user blamed the phone manufacturer, which is akin to putting the wrong fuel in your car and then blaming the car manufacturer that your car won't go.
  • mag-stripe. Considering they are a Korean company, I don't blame them for dropping a complex feature used by a select few in the US. Because the US is the only country left that thinks the ancient technology of the magnetic stripe is still a good medium for the transfer of your bank details. Contact-less paymemt is now pretty much standard everywhere else and is so much more secure and standardised. The range and reliability of the contact-less payment has increased massively for me on the S23 in comparison to the S20 which was also lumbered with magstipe support.
  • dilution of features? Again, why should it be more complicated? A larger phone can incorporate more lenses, screen and battery, but the core features and benefits should be the same to make the choice simpler for the consumer. Advertising of the range is simpler also.

Each to their own but these are just my views based on 11 years in the mobile phone retail business.

[–] IronRain 8 points 1 year ago (3 children)

I respectfully disagree, and I know this is a hot button topic. But isn't the fact that it IS a controversial topic that has trawled for 3+ years on various tech forums not evidence that it's a popular enough feature(s) to warrant consideration?

SD Card: If companies are so afraid of liability, they could simply have an initial warning dialogue about potential hardware failures. Why cripple a portion of your userbase because of the fault of others? I know it's anecdotal, but I have used 9 SD cards across various devices (including my current N20U and Tab S8 Ultra) without ever encountering an issue. I also back up my data as is proper data management. And just as the car company in your example would say to the idiot who filled it up with the wrong gas, they would refer them to the user manual (warning dialogue in this case), and dust their hands of the matter. And let's be honest, this is just a blatant cash grab to force customers to buy the larger storage sizes.

Mag-Stripe: There are still more shops that don't have the standard contactless payment where I live than there are that do. And I'm in Southern CA. Big box stores are not an issue, but the mom and pop shops that I frequent don't have it set up. I'm sure this is an issue that will eventually be solved, but it's just frustrating that the option was taken away from us.

Dilution of Features: Samsung already makes a huge range of phones. From $120 semi-disposable ones to $2K Folds. The consumer is confused enough. From A series, J, S, M, Fold, and Flip, every price is covered. And yet, what's the flagship (mainstream) phone? The S23U? For $1400, you get an extra camera compared to the S23+. You get a larger screen - which used to be the Note's job - plus another camera from the base 23. That $400-600 difference adds up to 1 camera (plus some sensors) and a larger screen and battery. Point being, the reason why I gravitated to the Note series before was because of all the jammed packed features in a single phone. I didn't have to decide if I wanted to feel FOMO for saving $400 and losing an extra camera. What I paid was what I got, and I knew I got the most bang for my buck.

I know this is controversial, but this is the hill I'm dying on. Samsung's reputation was built on "everything but the kitchen sink" when they were competing with LG, HTC, etc. Now? They're a naming convention from Pro and Pro Max away from another lawsuit with Apple. Who, by the way, brought SD cards back onto their flagship laptop series!

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[–] MargotRobbie 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Asus Zenfone 10 looks quite feature complete before the break, maybe you should consider it.

[–] IronRain 7 points 1 year ago

It doesn't have a SD card slot, unfortunately. At the moment, only Sony Xperia still carries it on the flagship level, so I'm eyeing that one for now. Fortunately, my N20U is still going strong, so I'll see what the field looks like when I upgrade. I guess whichever OEM decides to include a $0.50 piece of hardware will probably get my $1K+.

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[–] paultimate14 16 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Flagship has no headphone jack or even micro SD card. Absolute joke.

If they had those I would strongly consider buying. I was an LG person until they stopped making phones.

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Because of the bloat and their Knox bullshit making it difficult to impossible to remove said bloat with a custom ROM, I will not touch a Samsung phone.

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 year ago

I bought a Samsung because it was the only device with a headphone jack and removable battery. I have zero brand loyality - I just go with whoever makes the best device

[–] grue 15 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Samsung is a shit company and nobody should ever buy anything from them. Phones, TVs, appliances, it doesn't matter -- it's all either pre-infested with ads and malware or sabotaged with planned obsolescence.

[–] azdood85 7 points 1 year ago

You and I must have ad the same Samsung experience.

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[–] Dark_Blade 13 points 1 year ago

Hardware:

They make high-quality hardware and I like that they’re trying to do something new and interesting with foldable tech, but I’ve never been a fan of their Exynos processors and foldables (imo) have proven to be little more than a gimmick that sacrifices far too much on durability for minimal benefit to most people.

Software:

I hate bloatware, and I’m not a fan of their crusade against open bootloaders.

[–] fluckx 13 points 1 year ago

Good photos and the battery lasts quite a while too compared to my other phones I've had.

Overall it's great hardware with good photos and terrible software for me. I'll probably never buy it on a phone again because they're evolving in the way I'd rather not have them evolve.

They have their own unremovable:

  • contacts
  • calendar
  • browser
  • phone
  • messages
  • app store

Makes me feel like they're stealing all my info if I would use it. Besides a Google account they also want you to use a Samsung account which ( honestly ) makes the whole phone more confusing ( especially to older people like my parents ).

But yeah. Good photos and great battery life. I've got no real complaints of the tab s5 tablet which I use when travelling and streaming shows to the tv otherwise. Though I'd have to see if the newer tablets are as much of a dumpster fire software wise like their phones.

Side note: I even had somebody come up to me with their phone "because I work in IT". The default setting of a Samsung phone was to have the lock button activate bigsby rather than lock the phone. There's a setting somewhere to change that. But it definitely felt agressive pushing of bigsby that nobody ( at least around here ) uses/wants to use... Maybe it's different in other countries?

[–] zeppo 12 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (4 children)

Great hardware, especially as far as the screens. Questionable software environment. Last I had one, there were duplicates of most Google apps in inferior Samsung form, which was really useless, and they couldn’t be deleted (I think). While the display was s beautiful, another thing I didn’t like was I had one of the ones with curved glass on the sides, a Galaxy S9, which looked cool, was useless, and it ended up getting cracked on the side, so it was useless and fragile.

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[–] GamerBoy705 12 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Typing from a Samsung Galaxy A50 right now, as a long time Samsung user. I've always hated TouchWiz from the older days, but I really love One UI. I'd even go as far as to say that One UI is the best Android skin (controversial opinion, lol)!

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[–] dystop 10 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Unpopular opinion, but I love my Samsung phone - upgraded from an S9 to S21 not that long ago. I'm not a brand (or even OS) loyalist by any means, and Samsung has its flaws, but it's the phone that suits my needs the most.

Firstly, I need a "small-ish" phone for one-handed use during my commute in the subway. Of all the flagships, Samsung's is one of the few that has the triple-camera setup in a small form factor. Every other major phone maker puts the regular and ultrawide camera in the smaller flagship, and the zoom only comes in the bigger version.

Secondly, I've absolutely hated the new Android UI since... 12? The quick toggles are ridiculously big, and it makes me feel like i'm using kids' mode on my phone. And who thought it was a good idea to put the Wifi/data toggles behind a second layer of menu options? Samsung's UI fixes this right out of the box without a need for root.

As for the cons... I remember my S4 used to have horrible preinstalled software that came in the root partition and couldn't be uninstalled. But the newest Samsungs aren't that bad. It came with a few extra things, almost all of which could be uninstalled easily. Samsung also installs their own version of Calculator, Notes etc - some of them aren't bad at all, and the only annoying thing about their own utilities are that they force you to update them through Samsung's own app store. Their camera also tends to oversaturate colors, but it's a one-time effort to dial down the default saturation in the camera settings.

So yeah, the software has a few issues, but they're all a one-off fix, whereas my issue with other Android phones (no triple-camera setup in a smaller form factor + horrible quick toggles) are not fixable or require root.

Oh yeah. and Samsung DeX is amazing. I'm surprised Android doesn't have an equivalent feature. I love it when I can plug my phone into a monitor or TV at a hotel or a friend's house and play movies/games off my phone.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Samsung phones have so many quality of life improvements over the default Android experience that I don't think I can get away from them just from software alone (why do you have to scroll down twice to change the brightness on normal Android it's the most important function in the quick menu) Not to mention they're the only phones that I can seemingly drop as many times as I want without breaking screen. I'd love to switch to another company as I don't really like Samsung but every other software experience I've had has been abysmal.

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[–] MrNemobody 10 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I don't know about cheap Samsung phones, but their flagships are excellent. I'm pretty happy with mine.

[–] UnrealRealityX 8 points 1 year ago (3 children)

The best samsung phones are the 2 year old used flagship phones. All the power, features and longevity without the high sticker price. S21 Ultra is amazing at a fraction of the cost of new.

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[–] Speeder172 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I want the pure Android experience, not a phone coming with his package of uninstallable bloatware. Also, a phone is just a phone, I want to take pictures, use GPS, call and text. The Pixel are doing the same thing for half or 3times cheaper.

I also dislike Samsung repairability policy and how they care about their employees.

Fuck Samsung

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[–] TheControlled 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Crap phones that don't last, bad UI, filled with bloat and ads, don't play nice with the other Android kids, and steal their homework.

[–] Buddahriffic 7 points 1 year ago

I mean, on the one hand I've had two Samsung phones last me the past decade (and the older one still fires up when I want to use it). But on the other hand, I've decided I'll never buy a Samsung phone again. Their great hardware is marred by the Samsung software experience. The ad experience hasn't been bad actually, probably because I'm on a flagship model.

But I hate the button they force to be associated with their feature that I don't want. Every single time I've hit that button was either by accident or experimenting with how it works. Even though I have set up one of the alternative presses to launch an app of my choice, I never think of the button other than when I accidentally hit it and need to swear at it and Samsung.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago

Good hardware due to samsung producing most of its conponents directly, held back by samsungs fabs with exynos.

Other than that, dont use them because of bloat (devices I've used had a fairly light or almost aosp experience)

[–] MigratingtoLemmy 9 points 1 year ago

I will only purchase a Samsung again when they let me unlock the damn bootloader

[–] ohwhatfollyisman 9 points 1 year ago (3 children)

like i feel after a seven course dinner.

bloated.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago

Top notch camera, top specs, best software support. It’s usually my first choice when I look for an android phone.

A lot of the issues you listed are bad for people that want to mod their phones but they are pros for anyone that wants a secure phone. As I get older, I just want a phone that works that is actively supported and patched from security vulnerabilities.

[–] HRDS_654 9 points 1 year ago

The only thing I have to say is I couldn't get away from Samsung fast enough. The bloat is just ridiculous (like do I really need two voice assistants that I can't uninstall AND two stores for apps?), the UI is an abomination, and the camera processing always made my eyes bleed. As someone who dabbles in photography I hate that the camera prioritizes being vivid over all else. Probably the only good thing I can say about them is the build quality is great.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I still have my S21 and I <3 it

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[–] jacktherippah 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

No bootloader unlocking no buy.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago

Hate that you have to even go through the process of removing meta services. Wish it wasn't there.

But, love the OS which is more feature rich than the custom roms of the past I used to use when combined with Good Lock. Love one hand operation+ which lets me not have to bother with gestures anymore and almost everything being available with the side gestures and edge panel. And I don't want to go without a stylus again on a phone, since I use it a lot to do write quick notes without unlocking the phone or selecting text or using it in DS games.

[–] dis_honestfamiliar 6 points 1 year ago

Hardware fuse disabling Knox on bootloader is irrelevant now. You can't unlock bootloader. At least for snapdragon chip.

[–] Hazdaz 6 points 1 year ago (3 children)

My current phone is a Samsung and it is the first Samsung phone I have owned and maybe the last. I had previously only owned Motorola phones and absolutely loved them. The Samsung is a perfectly capable phone with (when new) top tier components for its class. The build quality is very good and the screen, of course, is gorgeous. But it's a boring device.

I loved all the extra little touches that Motorola gave me. They didn't change the OS too much, but just enough and the phones were better for it. With Samsung, it's the opposite. The changes are all for the worse. But let me be perfectly clear here, it is still a great phone for the masses, it's just boring.

I consider the Galaxy S line of phones is like the Toyota Camry. Good, reliable. Will do exactly what you need it to do, but don't expect to fall in love with it. It's a well engineered appliance aimed at the general public.

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[–] ilickfrogs 6 points 1 year ago

Really nice hardware, inexcusably bad software.

[–] Fredol 6 points 1 year ago

Too much bloat, no bootloader unlock. International model can be bootloader unlocked but you can't change secure boot keys and relock.

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