this post was submitted on 11 Aug 2024
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Mildly Infuriating

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Can you notice that it's a bit leaning to the right?

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[–] DrQuickbeam 232 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (4 children)

American in Italy here! I am not justifying this, just explaining it from an Italian perspective. First, the paper is not mixing up her Indian heritage here with Native American. They took the idea that she is seeking a white male VP running mate and wrote "hunting for a white man", which conjured up a "funny" homage to native Americans in spaghetti westerns, while giving a nod and a wink to the racism inherent in making the VP pick race-based. Second, this paper is a sensationalist rag sold in grocery store checkout lanes, with no expectation for the stories to be good, or free of any number of unsavory isms.

[–] [email protected] 33 points 3 months ago (2 children)

native Americans in spaghetti westerns.

I'm not sure how it is in Italy, but a lot of the older Italians I know absolutely love old westerns (of.... Varying quality)

[–] [email protected] 62 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Spaghetti westerns are called that because they originate from Italy.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Yep. They also created giant groups of people who think the saguaro cactus grows in Texas.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 3 months ago (5 children)
[–] [email protected] 13 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Yeah, the American West has a huge variety of very distinct biomes. For the purpose of telling a story though, one rocky desert or forested mountain vale or whatever is as good as another, leaving us, the audience, largely unaware and misled. We mostly only notice when they do that to areas we're familiar with.

Reminds me of the movie The Patriot, starring Mel Gibson. There's a scene where he is at his home in what is clearly the upcountry of South Carolina not too far from the Appalachians and he takes a walk down his garden path to visit his wife's grave, which is located in the South Carolina lowcountry, by the coast, somehow skipping past over a hundred miles of pine forest that would have been between those areas. If you're not familiar with those areas, they both just look like areas in the American Southeast, but if you are familiar, it's very jarring.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 3 months ago (2 children)

I had a similar experience with the TV show, Broadchurch.

I lived in one of the towns where it was filmed. The church, two of the main characters’ houses, the newspaper office, the high street, and the mechanic garage in the second season were all filmed in Clevedon, near Bristol. I lived about 100m from the church while they were filming it.

Watching the show, they’d walk down a familiar road, turn a corner, and suddenly they’d be on a beach in Dorset, 70 miles away. It was always jarring.

Great show though.

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 months ago

I watched some Gal Gadot movie recently, where she got on a motorbike in the far north of Iceland (Isafjordur airport) and rode to Reykjavik opera house in a matter of minutes. I'd consider both of these places to be somewhat landmarks as well.

But it didn't ruin it for me because it was terrible long before that. Arguably at the script and casting stages.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 months ago (1 children)

AZ and CA, and Mexico are where they grow, I believe.

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[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 months ago

Westerns are generally quite liked by the older generation. Leone's masterpieces are definitely cult movies that most people have watched.

[–] Duamerthrax 13 points 3 months ago

Second, this paper is a sensationalist rag sold in grocery store checkout lanes,

ah, that explains it.

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[–] kvasir476 109 points 3 months ago (2 children)

To be fair the Italians have a 500+ year history of mixing up Indigenous Americans and Indians.

[–] felixwhynot 32 points 3 months ago

It’s tradition!

[–] [email protected] 8 points 3 months ago (2 children)
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[–] [email protected] 52 points 3 months ago (5 children)

Europeans: Americans are so obsessed with race

Also Europeans:

[–] [email protected] 19 points 3 months ago (1 children)

This has almost nothing to do with race (or at least with hers), it's just a dumb analogy to play with the title in a western movie fashion. "Hunting the white man" refers to the search for a white vice-president that would play well with "wasp" population.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 months ago (3 children)

Basic Americans don't understand nuance or that other places have different ideas. To an American everything is done through America lens which frequently looks idiotic or poorly educated from outside.

[–] Maggoty 10 points 3 months ago (26 children)

I think any country would come asking questions if their political leaders were pictured with culturally sensitive stuff like this. Imagine if a mid tier US paper put modi in half Hindu half Muslim traditional clothing. To us it's a quick way to talk about the two biggest religions in that country. Modi would be pissed though.

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[–] batmaniam 7 points 3 months ago (1 children)

What's ironic is you're displaying exactly what you're critiquing. This joke is a bit funny, but it's on par with something like "Prince Charles asks NRA to fix his car". There's just baggage. And lord knows Italy has plenty of its own.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 months ago (6 children)

And lord knows Italy has plenty of its own.

Not when it comes to Native Americans though.

Considering that this is a national newspaper meant for locals, I don't think other culture's baggage should necessarily be taken in consideration.

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[–] Duamerthrax 4 points 3 months ago (6 children)

This isn't coming from a naive, "regular Joe" Italian. News papers should be a bit better about international sensitives.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I mean, they're right. The European version of racism is much more inattention and inexperience-fueled. This is arguably an example.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 3 months ago (3 children)

That is not my experience in Italy.

Just ask a European about gypsies or African migrants. It will get very racist very quickly.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Yeah, my experience has been that a lot of countries whose residents tell me racism is an American problem and we should stop trying to project it onto other societies happen to live in countries with huge problems with it that just aren't explicitly spoken about in the same terms.

I had a Brazilian friend tell me race is not all that important in Brazil and that he's tired of Americans assuming it is. I periodically have to ask him, "Do you read Brazilian news, bro?" and send some links that make it blatantly obvious that racism is alive and well down there.

You also just get people who have bought into very pervasive attitudes in countries that justify/explain away racism when it's encountered.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Brazilian acts like they don't have the same slaver history as US... They must really assume Americans are this fucking stupid not to k ow basics of how Brazil functions

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[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 months ago

Or Albanians, Romanians and other people with a history of migration (at least in Italy).

That said, the racist dynamics in Italy are still different from those of a country with a much different history, linked to slavery and colonialism (thankfully Italian empire was a ridiculously failed attempt), with a different racial distribution in population. African migrants are for example a relatively new phenomenon. We are now at the 2nd generation give or take, and I have the feeling things will normalize ad they did for balcan people, as long as right-wing governments will not sabotage immigration on purpose to maintain it as a problem and gather votes...

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[–] reddit_sux 51 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Europeans mistaking Americans for Indians for centuries.

[–] xantoxis 21 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Specifically Italians, at that.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 3 months ago

Classic Italian mistake.

[–] [email protected] 37 points 3 months ago

Italian here, they probably did it on purpose so that people would repost it and they succeeded.

[–] taiyang 31 points 3 months ago (1 children)

It's even worse if you consider that it's still offensive to Photoshop that on her even if she was Native American.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Perhaps they could remove some clothing and make her very muscular

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[–] njm1314 24 points 3 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 3 months ago

I prefer Italian women, but you know ... when on a road leading to Rome (but walking in the opposite direction for obvious reasons), one has to keep an open mind.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (2 children)

Well, at least it's casual racism, not professional racism.
Oh, it's a newspaper, so a bit professional I guess, but like they didn't use their "best" racists.

/s

Also who are the white folk they are referring to?
The other dude in the race is clearly orange (of some rapey citrus heritage). And the "catching" part, well, statistically speaking as DA she prob didn't do that much of that color either.

Everything around this is multilevel horribly resist, and yet the reality is several parallel universes ahead.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 3 months ago
[–] [email protected] 10 points 3 months ago (3 children)

As a European I will admit I have no idea what's "wrong" with the picture. Other than it just looking like a mouthpiece for people instead of actually reporting things

[–] [email protected] 16 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (3 children)

Someone, somewhere has evidently misinterpreted the fact that US presidential candidate Kamala Harris (pictured center) is of Indian ancestry - as in her family is from the country in south Asia - and instead photoshopped her into the stereotypical Native American "Indian" aesthetic. Why they have chosen to do this eludes me.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 3 months ago

Ohh! As a European I do know the difference between those two types. It just didn't click that they got it wrong, I thought they had the feathers wrong (like part of the wrong native American tribe or something)

[–] orrk 8 points 3 months ago (2 children)

because they don't actually know WHAT Indian she is, didn't bother to look into it, and assumed it to be the American one

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 3 months ago

No it's not that. Another comment explains it above, and it has to do with Western movies. Il tempo is usually just recommended to clean windows, but it's not what you (or OP) suggests.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 months ago

Everything about this image is completely messed up

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 3 months ago (1 children)

You don't even need to guess it based on whatever USA they posted at the centre. Just look at Giorgia Merdoni at the left.

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