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Screen manufacturers just did a similar thing with the jump from 1080p to 4k
The 1080 part of the original number referred to the number of pixels from top to bottom, 4k refers to left to right. 4k is actually only 2160 from top to bottom though (at the same aspect ratio).
So they quadrupled the number when it should have only doubled, and it was entirely a marketing thing.
There are 4x the pixels so.....
I don't disagree with the change either. Having a large number makes it more difficult to compare. After 2160 it's 4320. 2k, 4k, and 8k are far easier to remember and figure out the differences.
In my past life I was a video editor while 4k was still at its infancy, and my coworker was furious saying that reporters were idiots for saying that 4K was 4 times the size of HD, it was just the name. And I'm like, dude is actually 4 times more and show him a picture of the size comparison of both and he was really ashamed, but I told him it was ok because I was also thinking the same until I read an article about it.
Exactly. The up tick in resolution was slow, 360 to 480 to 720 to 1080. Relatively small improvements. Then we jump to 2160/4k and the resolution goes up by 400% from the previous 1080. 4k is 4x1080 screens put together.
There are 4x the pixels so.....
Totally agree, but then
2k, 4k, and 8k
Is internally inconsistent!
If 4k is four times the pixel count of 1080, then 2k means 1440 (-ish, it should be 1530) - that's fine. But then 8k must be 3050, but it is actually 4320!!!
So it can not refer to the number of pixels (quadratic scaling). On the other hand, if we assume linear scaling and 8k is 4320 and 4k is 2160, then 2k is 1080 - but 2k is never used in that context!
Edit: as you can see I'm very passionate about this XD
Why marketers are allowed to label the speed of a network is just beyond me as an engineer. Call it whatever you want. "Our Purple speed". Don't care. But underthat it should be labeled with a standard 1gbps/1gbps.
That would shut up xfinity's bullshit claims pretty quick. "Our new Plaid speed fiber" 200mbps/4mbps
Seriously I called them years ago asking about fiber, they were real hyped, they bragged they could give me 800! 800 what I asked. Megabytes! Megabytes or Megabits? 800 Megabits, okay fine, symmetric right? Well, no one uses upload anyway. That was their literal response.
symmetric right?
I talked about this in another thread recently, but my favorites are the ones that are so lopsided that you literally can't send back ACKs fast enough to keep up with your own download speeds when using TCP.
Download-only internet.
Your water line is now connected! There is no way to turn on the taps in the house.
But at least 4k is indeed 4 times bigger than 1080p, at least in terms of pixels, so it's not all bullshit in a way
I like to call 1440 "4k" as well because it's 4 times bigger than 720. Stupid fucking naming system
4K refers to the horizontal resolution of the video, not how much larger than FullHD it is.
Also 1440p is sometimes called QHD (Quad HD) because it’s 4x 720p aka HD
The correct naming scheme btw, if you don’t subscribe to bad marketing:
640x480 = SD (NTSC)
768x576 = SD (PAL)
1280x720 = HD
1920x1080 = FullHD/FHD
2048x1080 = DCI 2K
2560x1440 = QuadHD/QHD
3840x2160 = UHD
4096x2160 = DCI 4K
7680x4320= UHD2
And 4K isn‘t even correct in the horizontal direction. "4K" TVs have a horizontal resolution of 3840 pixels. That’s 3.8K. True 4K, as used in movie production (aka DCI 4K) is 4096x2160
The worst part is that it's actually less than 4k pixels on the top.
2160p is not that uncommon though. Saying 4K is just an abbreviation and it's easier to say while still letting everyone know what you're talking about. I don't actually like the term 4K though because it's a bit ambiguous because of how many different flavors of 4K there are.
Ars reported on this at the end of January.
Comcast reluctantly agrees to stop its misleading “10G Network” claims. Comcast said it will drop "Xfinity 10G Network" brand name after losing appeal.
They say that but are running the ads this very night during college basketball games…
Yeah, it’s still confusing. It could be that since the ruling was made less than a month ago, there are active ad campaigns that they’re just going to let run their course, rather than cancel them.
But also, note the following from the source article:
Comcast said it may still use 10G in ways that are less likely to confuse consumers. "Consistent with the panel's recommendation... Comcast reserves the right to use the term '10G' or 'Xfinity 10G' in a manner that does not misleadingly describe the Xfinity network itself," the company said.
When contacted by Ars, a Comcast spokesperson said, "We disagree with the decision but are pleased that we have confirmed our continued use of 10G in advertising."
So maybe Ars overstepped in their headline?
You are conflating Internet service speed and mobile generations. I work for an ISP. I hear this all the time. Especially since there's also "5G WiFi" which is 5 GHz band. People confuse it all, and it's understandable but still annoying.
My company offers 1 Gbps service. No one is getting confused by that yet, but our modems have 2.5 Gbps Ethernet ports now, and I had a customer that was outraged the other day because "Your modem is only 2.5 G and all my devices use 5G! You need to send me a 5G modem!!" FFS
Sure, but they really should be describing it as 10Gb (gigabit). Even that could easily get confused with 10GB (gigabyte), which would be used for a file size.
Pretty sure they're getting sued on 10g.
But 5g is bullshit too.
The telecoms agreed what threshold of improvement warranted a "new g" but they sell more funa when the number goes up.
So they started making up sub versions of 4g and then all agreed to have 5g before meeting the threshold for it.
Yep, this is exactly it. When 3g was going away and 4g was starting up, T-Mobile pulled the same thing trying to brand their UMTS stuff as 4g when it's clearly a 3g protocol. You can always rely on the marketers to lie until the end of time.
It was hilariously reading the presser on NBCComcrap talking about how 10G DOCSIS development is progressing and they could almost hit 10Gbps in labs on the downlink but uplink would only be a few hundred megabits tops. Like, none of those numbers are worth selling a marketing brand of "10G". Real fiber Internet can hit it, my provider offers 10Gbps/10Gbps. That could be called "10G" - if we continued to conflate speed with generations like Comcrap tried to do.
I really wish the FCC would step up and slap all these companies perpetuating these weird lie terms the last half a decade.
I am so, so, SO glad I'm now in a home with access to fiber Internet. Real, 2 gigabit symmetric fiber.
The cable company keeps sending me glossy ads in the mail - several per week - trying to get me to go back to 1/4 the bandwidth at the same price. Uhhhh... no.
Same here. Before fiber came to my suburb I could only choose AT&T or Comcast. AT&T’s fastest plan was 50mbps and never pulled more than 30. They’ve had permits here to put up Verizon 5G towers for 5 years but haven’t built a single one because of the tin foil hat brigade. I would love to switch to Verizon because I’d save a shitload on bundling it with my cell phones. Verizon has LTE but that would be like going back to the DSL.
ITU defined 4G in 2008 as wireless connectivity with speed of 100 megabits per second for mobile users and 1 gigabit per second for stationary users.
LTE never achieved such speeds. It did not stop mobile operators from calling their service 4G.
ITU since then revised their definition to lower the required network speed.
5G was supposed to have network speeds of 10 gigabits per second. ITU however wisened up and are just defining it as 'fifth-generation wireless', because the mobile operators will butcher the definition anyway.
Well there you have it. If ITU hasn't defined 10G, then ISP's can call it whatever they want. It's not regulated.
This smells a bit like the old Fuck Everything, We're Doing Five Blades.
Pretty funny the blades on disposables actually did top out at 5. The Onion wins the prediction game again.
(I know there's a 6 blade brand out there but I think it's the only one, whereas all the big companies make 5. So glad I got out of the disposables and traded them for safety razors anyway-- dunno why it took me so long)
Probably fear of cutting yourself with that single blade.
That's what took me so long.
BTW, anyone here who face shaves regularly, switch to a safety razor. This is a threat.
Because of all the bullshit with subsidies etc. intended for improving broadband infrastructure being abused, my dream is:
You have my vote if you run for office.
I’ve heard in other countries they have a CHOICE of electricity providers. Boggles my mind. CHOOSE who you buy electricity from? Like more than 1?
They should be forced to have a standard like a food label. Should show average speed and uptime for past 12 months
Crazy idea...
Phone OS developers often fight with carriers about the network labels that get displayed on a phone's status bar. Carriers often demand a certain name and label to be shown.
Apple does some shitty stuff, but they have often been able to strong-arm carriers into industry-wide customer experience improvements, because they have a monopoly on iOS and have fast OS update adoption. Apple should just push a software update that always shows bandwidth instead of "4G," "LTE," "5G." Then they should update their maps app to show crowd sourced bandwidth speeds across a carriers's network.
Air their dirty laundry and watch them squirm.
Honestly, this is the same shit the telcoms have been doing for decades. They also did it with the previous generations.
When telcoms started promoting “3G” it was a mix between networks with proper broadband speeds, and edge networks that were more like 2.5G. 4G was an even bigger dumpster fire with a very wide array of “fourth generation” specs that ranged from glorified 3G to actual next generation speeds. And 5G is a repeat of this marketing bullshit trend.
You can really see the effects of this if you get to rural coverage areas. Your phone might say it’s on 5G or 4G, and you might be experiencing shit speeds even if you have decent reception. You might be on a part of the network that the marketing department considers 4 or 5G, but doesn’t mean it’s actually fast.
IMHO, we need consumer protection laws that prevent companies from using brand names or generational buzz words to trick customers. Network speeds should be advertised in bits per second, or standardized BPS chunks.
Cell carriers in the US releasing 3G+ technologies branded as 4Gs should have gotten the FTC on a crackdown, but regulatory capture and it is all just marketing fluff. The sales flacks selling it can't even answer questions like "what kinds of bandwidth can I expect to see? Do I get a minimum QoS?"
“You’re minimum speed in your area is 5G with Unlimited Stream Blast+”
Xfinity is Comcast. It’s incredible they were able to rebrand themselves.
Comcast can't even do symmetric speeds. I'm not sure what locations have thier best speeds but in my area, where they compete with the much more affordable but not as large coverage area offerings of fiber. The idea that they could offer even a signle gigabit level service to the majority of their customers is laughable.
I bet it did lead to a lot of confusion especially when you called up for 10GIGABITS and got offered plans in the Megabits with usage limits and overage fees and all kinds of complicated shit. I called in to cancel my service a few months back when i moved to an area with fiber again, they said "we offer gigabit too you know" and i was like , nah you kinda don't actually, but even if you did its like 3 times as expensive for just the download speeds.
I was genuinely convinced they offered 10gig service in some markets. Doesn't surprise me that its all marketing nonsense.
Just a tip for anyone who wants to know, if you have Comcast business internet they'll tell you you have to use their modem but, you can swap it out with a 3rd patty modem and use the live chat service to get it activated. Then you can send back their modem for free at a ups store. Every salesperson will tell you its not possible but it absolutely is.
Wireless "G" labeling has always mostly been marketing wank anyway.
The actual technology has used more pragmatic (if less marketing friendly) terminology.
Absolutely. 3G, 4G, 5G - they’re all a mess. Each G is a wild mix of specs with wildly varying speeds. And many parts of a next generation network are a glorified version of the previous generation network with no large generational speed bumps.
Government organizations like the FCC should force telecoms to advertise speeds as bits per second.
Fuck Comcast. Even when it was clear what they were referring to, they made it seem like they were offering 10gigabit fiber service. Nope, same old service offerings. There’s some plausibility: some of us have had gigabit fiber for years and if ComCast wants to reset its reputation. One way is to jump ahead rolling out the next generation of technology. Nope. @Next generation of technology” is apparently upgrading their infrastructure to be able to achieve what they’ve sold for years
Is 200/20M asymmetric, over provisioned up the wazoo, shared across the neighborhood m, high latency, any better now that it’s relabeled?
I've personally had ok experiences with them. There service is fast and well priced. There support can be a little annoying at times but they get the job done for the most part.
Compare that to AT&T which is expensive and awful to deal with. There support is the worst support I've ever talked to. I had to deal with them for work and they kept transferring me repeatedly and I even managed to get on the line with a computer trying to sell me an alert button in case I fell.
United States of Advertising