this post was submitted on 24 May 2024
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On Tuesday, voters in Crook County passed measure 7-86, which asked voters if they support negotiations to move the Oregon/Idaho border to include Crook County in Idaho.  The measure is passing with 53% of the vote, and makes Crook County the 13th county in eastern Oregon to pass a Greater Idaho measure.

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[–] Wogi 53 points 1 month ago (8 children)

I can really sympathize with these guys. I live in a blue dot in one of the reddest states in the country. I have been talking with my friends about doing this exact thing.

Technically this is not secession. It's partitioning. They want to partition themselves and join Idaho. Just like I'd love to partition my city away from the shit hole parasitic state it's attached to.

The state level representation just isn't there for them. They're so dramatically in the minority that they have no voice in state government at all. So changes are mandated to them, and they're disillusioned. They love their home and they want the government to recognize them.

Set aside the crazy bullshit they want. The grievance is legitimate, the government completely ignores their desires, they haven't been able to get the government to acknowledge that, and so they retaliate by saying they don't want to be a part of it anymore.

To be clear, there is no resolution for people in this situation. They have no control over the state government, no ability to change it. The only choice is to leave, and faced with moving or a long shot at leaving or taking your home with you, you'd choose to take your home, every time.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

What do they want that Idaho can provide that Oregon can't? Some people have to flee entire states over abortion laws for lifesaving medical procedures and they're told stuff like "well if you don't like it just move".

[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 month ago

The ability to be more open about being white supremacist garbage. Idaho is a dumpster fire - the state is suffering shortages of medical professionals because of the GQP.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 month ago

Imagine scraping the money together to move from Idaho to Oregon to protect your health and bodily autonomy, then 300 of your neighbors get together and decide, nope, you’re still in Idaho.

[–] Wogi 1 points 1 month ago (2 children)

I appreciate that. And this is a great example to whip out when those idiots say shit like that. Obviously moving isn't an option for most people and for those whom it is, they likely have.

What exactly they want isn't important, just that it's very much the opposite of how the state is being run. Admittedly some of the demands fall under crazy bullshit, but the central issue is agency. Politically speaking they have very little, and this is the one lever left to them to pull.

Imagine you're on a train of trolleys, and every time it comes to a point where a direction could be chosen, every car votes and consistently the ones at the back are out voted by the other cars. You can't get off and buy another ticket. But you might be able to detach the cars.

Furthermore, reorganization like this should be done far more frequently than it's being done. Why shouldn't we allow disparate peoples of similar opinions vote together and govern each other? Why are we locked in to the lines on a map, the last major change of which happened in 1867. Since then, the borders have remained relatively unchanged.

Not only should they, a group of people I likely hold only one fundamental belief in common with, not be afforded some self governance?

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 month ago

Imagine you're on a train of trolleys, and every time it comes to a point where a direction could be chosen, every car votes and consistently the ones at the back are out voted by the other cars. You can't get off and buy another ticket. But you might be able to detach the cars.

So, you're describing the 47% who do not want to partition?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 month ago

Admittedly some of the demands fall under crazy bullshit, but the central issue is agency.

It’s like saying “it’s not about slavery, it’s about states rights.”

[–] SeattleRain 19 points 1 month ago (1 children)

This is caused by Gerrymandering and antidemocratic voter suppression. But Republicans don't want to fix those issues because they'd be a regional party overnight limited to just the south.

[–] Buddahriffic 15 points 1 month ago

Though it is only 53% of them that want this. Not that I think that should cancel the entire vote, but it should complicate the situation because a 6% difference shouldn't change the situation into one that 47% don't want.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I live in a blue dot in one of the reddest states in the country.

Austin Texas.

[–] Hackworth 7 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Or Lawrence, KS, or Lincoln, NE, or Atlanta, GA

[–] randon31415 7 points 1 month ago

Omaha is the blue dot in NE. I'm from Nebraska. Even though it might be liberal, Lincoln is definitely a Big Red dot.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 month ago

Or Asheville NC

[–] Burn_The_Right 4 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

The grievance is legitimate, the government completely ignores their desires...

I see your point, but their "desires" are to oppress or kill the normal people, so I just don't see their grievances as legitimate. Conservatives are furious that they are unable to use legislation to further their conservative values of racism, homophobia, misogyny, xenophobia, transphobia, antisemitism and other conservative bigotry. There is simply no room in a modern culture for hate-based ideologies like conservatism.

We should not legitimize their harmful desires by recognizing their "grievances". Instead, we should marginalize hate by marginalizing the haters.

In short, fuck 'em.

[–] Maggoty 4 points 1 month ago

Well half of them at any rate. I guess the other half just get shit on? Usually these kinds of measures require more like 3/4 votes.

[–] Fedizen 2 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

This is why proportional voting is good. The best answer is to give them more accurate representation as part of oregon.

Without some trade for like a blue part of idaho this trade just stacks the deck one way. not 100% of the people in those districts want to leave and there's blue parts of idaho, why not trade those for red parts of oregon if it's "just partitioning" why abandon the 20-49% of whomever is in those red districts that would go straight back to being unrepresented

No, this is just right wingers wanting things 100% their way with no reasonable offer on the the table. There's no "legitimacy" here.