By that logic, we should then remove all barriers to run. If a convicted criminal can run, there's no reason a 28 year old with no criminal background can't.
this post was submitted on 21 Aug 2023
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(Getting this out of the way first: I'm not a Trump supporter.)
Convicted felons can and have run for President in the past. Some campaigns have even been run from prison. Disqualifying somebody from running for office because of a conviction is extremely easy to weaponize. It's the next step in removing somebody's right to vote because of a conviction (a thing we do/have done and shouldn't).
I agree with you on the age thing, though. If you can vote, you should be able to hold office.
I think the charges are pertinent. Anything directly related to undermining the very democracy you seek to lead, should be disqualifying. Likewise anyone convicted of some voter fraud crimes should have their right to vote revoked. Now I don't mean all crimes in this areas. But there are definitely some that should stick around
cough cough 14th Amendment, Section 3. cough cough
For those who don't want to follow the reference:
Fourteenth Amendment Equal Protection and Other Rights
Section 3 Disqualification from Holding Office
No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
This is the correct answer, in my opinion. Someone that went through a tough patch earlier in life and was convicted of stealing a car or something? Largely irrelevant to their ability to govern, if previous crimes were compensated for (i.e. they served their sentence). Actively inciting a coup to forcefully stay in office? Yeah, that's a deal breaker.
Regardless, if Trump gets convicted of any of these crimes, that mother fucker will be serving prison time. How can he possibly be president if he's in jail? At least, for this 2024 cycle. Honestly, I don't see him lasting another 10 years anyway, so I feel this whole debate will ultimately serve fruitless beyond the 2024 presidency.
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Well, basically, this is the gist of "a republic, if you can keep it". At the end of the day, my boy Montesquieu's words hang over all government like a spectre. Governments rule only by the consent of the governed. If everyone woke up tomorrow and decided we wanted Lenin's mummified goatee to be president, constitution be damned, Biden be damned, it'd be the president.
If this actually works, the next step will be abolishing the two-term limit. "Leave it to the will of the people to decide if they want a dictatorship."
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He’s so damn scared of taking a hard stance on trump. Pathetic, sniveling coward
The "Law and Order" party is now cool with all laws being subject to a popularity contest.
They were never the law and order party. They were and are the put minorities and poor in prison party.
Remember it's all about hurting the right people.
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Left to the American people? So he favors a direct popular vote, without an electoral college?
Ok.
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Abusive Relationship 101
It’s not that he actually believes this, it’s that the party’s base has determined that you can’t oppose Trump, so they need to find a reason why people should vote for them instead of Trump while not taking the position that Trump should be in jail.
It’s the usual mental gymnastics. Desantis is doing the exact same thing.
This is the best answer.
An assault on Trump is an assault on the idiots who made it their identity to support him.
They can't let him be insulted.
The only winning move is to just offer a better solution and ignore him.
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Funny how convicted felons can have their voting rights taken away, but letting a person who tried to sabotage the voting system to win unfairly run for president again? Suuure!
Not only that, but it's a direct parallel to how the rich have so much more rights than the poor - and the worst part is this guy's fans ARE dirt poor, some may even be felons, who have no right to vote, some of which probably tried to vote illegally because "owning the libs is what matters"... because again, decentralisation, proper vote count, democratic and parliamentary process, this is all bullshit anyways, so let's just game the system!
Like you have to be a special kind of stupid - and I don't mean that in an ableist kind of way, but in a way that this needs to be studied by scientists, because of how absurdly brain-dead it really is.
Like here's a hint: if you set a political precedent where your guy can do it, what's to prevent the other guy from doing it? Does MAGA stand for "make America gullible again"?
I agree with the sentiment that his actions should preclude him from running, but felon disenfranchisement is something that isn't talked about nearly enough and I think it's absolutely insane so many people lose their RIGHT to vote.
Given the surge in felony disenfranchisement laws during the Civil War and after the adoption of the 14th Amendment makes it pretty damn clear that it was to keep black people from voting. And looking at the US map of the 2023 felony disenfranchisement laws, it is pretty damn clear that not much has changed.
Like US states were originally against state police, because their local sheriff and local "court systems" did just fine. Can you guess why state police and also inter-state police collaboration became a thing?
If you said to catch freemen and return them to slavery for jaywalking or looking at a white woman the wrong way, you'd sadly be correct.
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Didnt the American People give themselves a constitution and laws already for this reason?
14th amendment, section 3.
No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/amendment-14/
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There is nothing more cowardly than a Republican.
Does pence know what justice being "left to the people" looks like?
It's fuckin' guillotiney, mate.
Considering they built a guillotine outside the Capitol for him, you'd think he would.
In the interest of accuracy, it was a gallows.
See this is the ridiculous misinformation the left spreads. The rioters were never threatening to kill Pence with a guillotine, it was just a harmless gallows
Republican Logic (or lack there of)
Impeachment for high crimes and misdemeanors? “No. That should be left to the people”
Impeachment for treason? “No. That should be left to the people”
Legal repercussions for blatant lawlessness? “No. That should be left to the people”
Losing election because you are a threat to the society? “Lol. That should NOT be left to the people. Find me 11,800 votes right now”
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Jesus, what an absurd, chickenshit take.
I mean, of course he said that. He's trying to win a republican primary race right now. Would disagreeing with the overwhelming majority of the primary voting repub electorate be a good strategy for accomplishing that?
Yeah, but Trump tried to kill him. I mean I know he has no integrity or shame, but to see it on this level still amazes me.
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he definitely has a cuck fetish
Seems to the GOP some parts of the Constitution are merely guidelines. Specifically, the parts that are inconvenient to them.
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So Republicans are going to just gonna act like the 3rd section of the 14th amendment doesn't exist? And they think this is a winning strategy?
Section 3 Disqualification from Holding Office
No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
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Such a cowardly response. Just like most Republicans right now.
He's already persona non grata with MAGA. That ship has sailed, Mike; it's over the fucking horizon, buddy. TBH, if he'd taken a hard stance and has been saying "yeah, bitch, that's right, I alone saved democracy and prevented a civil war*, die mad about it", I'd like him a lot more, I'd even consider him a serious contender for the GOP candidacy. But Mike can't seem to decide who he is. One day he wakes up and it's right back to simpering up to Trump and MAGA, and the next day he wakes up and lets MAGA know that he's got the world's biggest case of Ligma. Which is it, Mike: are you a crony with a spine that's weaker than Raditz, or are you a democracy saving, woman avoiding, sigma grinding badass?
*I know that Mike alone didn't save democracy, but, speaking as someone who's never voted Republican his whole life, it's undeniable that Mike played a crucial role in the outcome of J6. It's one of those few moments in history that really was balanced on the point of a knife and Pence did exactly the right thing by consistently refusing to play ball with these fucks.
So he won't be able to vote but he can be President. Hilarious.
Pence showing some old testament level Stockholm syndrome
So it's only when it comes to the right to bear arms that the constitution actually matters?
As a non US citizen living in Europe US Republican things are confusing to say the least.... 😂
Just like the bible, only certain parts are treated as being meant literally
Incredible how one orange fat man can be this much of a Boogeyman to republicans.
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So, he’s against the constitution then?
The people did decide already, when it got included in the constitution.
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The equation in my mind is, is this guy just trying to show that he’s a Republican team player, or does he actually think that some of Trump’s cult might vote for him if Trump isn’t on the ballot? Or maybe he’s holding on to a hope that if his former boss can stay out of jail long enough to get the nomination, that he might get his old job back?
All bad choices.
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The American people have spoken, and have agreed on a law that disqualifies them. Lets put it to a vote and see if we should change that law?
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