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Killed women count: 80 women allegedly killed by men in UK in 2024 (www.theguardian.com)

submitted 3 days ago by [email protected] to c/world

33 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Throughout 2024, the Guardian aimed to report on every woman allegedly killed by a man, drawing on the work of campaigns such as Counting Dead Women, the Femicide Census and Killed Women.

In recent years in the UK, a woman has been killed by a man every three days on average, yet most of their stories have gone unheard. The Guardian wants to help change that.

This year, the toll of women whose deaths have led to a man being charged has reached 80. Here, we mark each of their lives.

None of these incidents are linked in any way other than that a woman has been killed and a man charged in connection with her death.

all 34 comments

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[–] FourPacketsOfPeanuts 30 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Obviously horrible but somehow less than I thought it would be :/

[–] JeeBaiChow 6 points 2 days ago

This stat is meaningless without the full context. How many men were killed in the same period? How many women committed murders in the same? How many men killed by women in the same? Putting a gender label on a headline might do well for clicks and enraging an easily triggered segment of the population, but hardly points to any issue that needs addressing.

[–] TheBananaKing 18 points 3 days ago (4 children)

How many men were killed in the same period?

[–] Kbobabob 4 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Hard to tell exactly but I find this that says there were 583 homicides.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/283093/homicides-in-england-and-wales/

[–] TheBananaKing 4 points 3 days ago (3 children)

So why the fuck isn't the story that seven times as many men get killed?

[–] spongebue 11 points 3 days ago (1 children)

I would be curious to know the cross-gender numbers. How many men killed women and vice versa? I would imagine there's a pretty big imbalance there* but would want to see the numbers instead of my own feelings. That very well could tell a story.

* to be clear, I'm a man and not the kind who thinks that all men are predators or whatever. What I said above was based on the fact that here in the US, the overwhelming majority of school shootings are committed by men and there are easy to find numbers to back it up. But that doesn't necessarily apply to overall killings by adults in another country.

[–] chonglibloodsport 5 points 3 days ago (1 children)

That doesn’t solve anything. This is not a competition. If we’re discussing this issue in good faith then we should be trying to dig deeper into the root causes rather than just tallying up the scores.

I think it’s pretty firmly established scientifically that men are a lot more violent and dangerous than women. We tend to have a lot larger muscle mass and higher bone density as well as higher propensity for violent aggression.

However I think it’s also pretty firmly established that, although by far most of the violent crimes are committed by men, by far most men never commit a violent crime of any sort. So what we’re actually dealing with is a small percentage of all men who commit nearly all violent crimes.

So then what are we to do about it? We need to find ways to detect these men (men with a high propensity for violent aggression) and intervene to help steer them away from aggression, to better manage their anger, or to otherwise find ways to mitigate their risk of offending.

[–] spongebue 1 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (1 children)

Fair points, but my comment was in light of all the "but more men are getting killed!" comments. The victim's gender without context isn't a very interesting data point to me, but it could very well be if you combine it with something else like the gender of the killer.

[–] chonglibloodsport 5 points 3 days ago

It’s not really any more interesting. We’re never going to see an epidemic of women killing each other. There’s no all-female gangs out there that I know of. The most common female-on-female violence is high school bullying.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 days ago

Because that isn't the case? The article doesn't state 80 women were killed in total, but that 80 women were killed allegedly by men. So the total amount of killed women is higher than 80

[–] JeeBaiChow 0 points 2 days ago

As a man I'm deeply troubled that it's not safe for me to go out anymore. More protections for the male gender, thanks!

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 days ago

How many men were killed by women in the same time period?

[+] Warl0k3 -14 points 3 days ago (2 children)

Oh hush, thats a whattaboutism and you know it.

[–] JustARaccoon 18 points 3 days ago (2 children)

It shouldn't discredit the women's deaths, but we do live in a climate where men are seen exclusively as current and temporarily embarrassed perpetrators, and less so as fellow victims.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 3 days ago (1 children)

How many men are killed because they are men?

The violence men face is different from the one women face.

[–] lennybird 4 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (1 children)

we do live in a climate where men are seen exclusively as current and temporarily embarrassed perpetrators, and less so as fellow victims.

All due respect, but where is your evidence because the way I see it is this (male here btw):

Men perpetrate the vast majority of homicides.
Men overwhelmingly control the vast majority of wealth and power positions, globally.
Men are responsible for the vast majority of wars throughout history.
Men are responsible for the majority of physical domestic violence cases — particularly those leading to homicide.
Is there anywhere in the world where men are oppressed by women the way women are in, say, Afghanistan or Iran or Russia (legalized domestic violence)?

The data in the UK probably doesn't exist because the instances are that much more rare. I'm open to being wrong, but until numbers are brought to the table, we're talking data vs. speculation. What we do know is that Men account for 85-95% of convicted homicides, globally, making an outsized number relative to the portion that they are victims (somewhere around 75%). Of this subset, the most rare scenario is a male victim and female perpetrator.

There are of course instances of women murdering men and those should not be downplayed; but let's neither invoke a false equivalence fallacy.

[–] Alexstarfire 5 points 3 days ago (1 children)

No one said they were oppressed. They said men can also be victims.

[–] lennybird 5 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Of course. It's just a curious comment section that shifts to a falsely equivalent whataboutism fallacy when the subject-matter at hand given the submission is a very present and documented danger. I of course would not be opposed to anyone submitting data that they or someone else gathers for male victims of female perpetrators, too.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 days ago

According to data I shouldn't be getting into any relationship with a woman because they're the leading perpetrators of psychological violence. I could be driven into depression, into suicide, even to be physically violent.

Can we please the fuck stop weaponising the behaviour of assclowns. On either side.

[–] FourPacketsOfPeanuts 3 points 3 days ago

You realise a campaign like the guardians only starts because someone literally says "but what about the women?"

[–] FlyingSquid 15 points 3 days ago (2 children)

If you're wondering how many it is for the U.S. like I was...

https://airtable.com/appiYYO2XvT0RInXN/shrQ0MOJtPlAcMTgy/tblo5x5O8JpmdCrzd/viwLMBSlQYqwPlfsz

[–] TheTechnician27 13 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (1 children)

For context, in 2023, the US had 19,252 cases of murder or voluntary manslaughter. The US is projected to have a 16% nationwide drop in homicides in 2024 ("homicide" includes involuntary manslaughter, so it's not technically one-to-one).

We'll be really generous to murder and voluntary manslaughter and assume that those actually dropped by what would be a substantial 20% (even though it could be lower than 16% too). Then we have about 15,400 of these cases. Under that assumption (which I think is pretty reasonable as most likely a very conservative undercount), this represents about 4.5% of intentional killings in the US. To my understanding, the overwhelming majority is male-on-male. After that, I have no clue where female-on-female and female-on-male land.

(EDIT: That being said, it's entirely possible and likely that this linked database is an undercount. Although overall, it seems pretty scrupulous; I doubt the size would increase by more than maybe 10% if it were to be complete.)

[–] sychthys 5 points 3 days ago (1 children)

EDIT: That being said, it's entirely possible and likely that this linked database is an undercount.

I can tell you with certainty that it is an undercount. It stops at the end of November. My cousin was murdered by her husband in late December. Not his first time physically abusing her, and despite him being booked this time last year for it, nothing was done. This is the result.

[–] TheTechnician27 4 points 3 days ago

I'm so sorry for your loss. Restraining orders in this country are a joke.

[–] Narauko 6 points 3 days ago

Roughly 1 in 473,000 if I mathed that right? Why did I not expect that to be half of Australia's odds? I feel like that should be reversed for some reason, but I guess that's a good thing for America for once? Obviously should be better, but not as bad as I thought it would be. Now I get the above poster's worry about Australia though.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 3 days ago (3 children)

I'm sad to say that apparently Australia has the unevitable situation where 100 women were killed by men in 2024.

The population of the UK is 68 million, Australia is 27 million.

Just think about that for a moment.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

Canada had 172 women murdered by men in 2024. Population is 41.6 million.

[–] Narauko 7 points 3 days ago (1 children)

1 in 270,000? Ignoring what those odds are actually for, I'd like those numbers. Less than getting struck by lightning, more than a shark attack. More than good enough odds for just about any bet. Not exactly the intention behind thinking about it for a moment, but it was one of those intrusive thoughts....

If only it was as noteworthy for rarity as struck by lightning, instead of the statistic it is.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Not all Australian humans are female..

[–] [email protected] -2 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

and not all Australian killers are male

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 days ago

the data for this year isn't out yet but apparently the stat for last year was 409 people murdered in Australia, so i guess ~102 is what you'd expect if every gender killed equally