this post was submitted on 20 Sep 2024

619 points (99.0% liked)

News

23639 readers

3770 users here now

Welcome to the News community!

Rules:

1. Be civil

Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.

2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.

Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.

3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.

Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.

4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.

Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.

5. Only recent news is allowed.

Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.

6. All posts must be news articles.

No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.

7. No duplicate posts.

If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.

8. Misinformation is prohibited.

Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.

9. No link shorteners.

The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.

10. Don't copy entire article in your post body

For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.

founded 2 years ago

MODERATORS

619

Smell of burnt cannabis alone no longer justifies a police search of a vehicle, Illinois Supreme Court rules (www.chicagotribune.com)

submitted 3 months ago by gAlienLifeform to c/news

61 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Archived at https://web.archive.org/web/20240920014357/https://www.chicagotribune.com/2024/09/19/smell-of-burnt-cannabis-alone-no-longer-justifies-a-police-search-of-a-vehicle-illinois-supreme-court-rules/

top 50 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old

[–] [email protected] 79 points 3 months ago (22 children)

That's good. The article talks about how K9's should be handled with the legalization of weed. Should they be retired if they still respond to weed, etc.

Of course K9's aren't trained to actually smell anything. They're just trained to respond to an officers command, giving police the freedom to search any vehicle they please.

load more comments (22 replies)

[–] [email protected] 65 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Shit I thought that became the case when Illinois passed its recreational law.

Will police have to retire police dogs if they still react to weed?

Yes. Police dogs "alerting" on something that isn't illegal, in a way that is indistinguishable from "alerting" on something that is illegal, are no longer qualified to be drug sniffers.

[–] [email protected] 45 points 3 months ago (1 children)

That makes it no different than it already is, most of those dogs will "alert" whenever they're signaled regardless whether they smell anything. Information online suggests anywhere between a 26-44% positive ID rate though numbers on that seem a bit sketchy from different sources.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Hence the quotes around "alert." I chose to keep my previous comment about accurate dog sniffs in order to address the question of "police dogs that react to weed even though the smell of weed is not illegal." Inaccurate sniffs are a completely valid, but separate concern.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 months ago

Fair enough, point taken.

[–] Camzing 46 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Drugs won the war!

[–] [email protected] 43 points 3 months ago (1 children)

And just like most wars, it was bullshit that it was fought in the first place and the largest source of casualties was innocents.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 3 months ago (1 children)

They needed some excuse to give hippies felonies so they couldn't vote

[–] Dearth 8 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Don't forget black and brown people. White conservatives hate it when anyone but them participate in democracy

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 months ago

They made cocaine illegal for black people

[–] FlyingSquid 38 points 3 months ago

Good, because that's absolute bullshit. Especially when it's legal in Illinois.

That said, don't drive while high please.

[–] [email protected] 37 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (4 children)

This is the police .... if you get pulled over by a jerk of an officer, they'll find a different excuse to search your vehicle ... or at the very least hold you up, get you out of your car and generally give you a hard time.

Do your lights work? How's your tire treadwear? Is your documentation up to date? You were driving about five over the limit. This is a ride check.

And one of the worst questions I absolutely hate being asked by a cop ... "Where are you going?"

[–] [email protected] 23 points 3 months ago (3 children)

Remember, they are asking if they can search your vehicle. You are allowed to say no. Then they must justify an arrest

[–] [email protected] 31 points 3 months ago (2 children)

It's an imbalance of power.

If a guy with a gun and a license to kill ... which is basically what a police officer is ... if they start asking questions, I'm answering politely.

I'm not going to argue with them or disagree with them .. even if I say 'no' I'm still at risk based on the personality of the cop.

I'm also a big brown skinned long haired indigenous person so whenever I get stopped by a cop ... I'm doing what I'm told or I risk getting beaten, arrested or even shot.

This is also the reason why I placed four different cameras with audio around my vehicle.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 3 months ago

Okay, that is absolutely fair, and I do not blame you one bit for doing what you have to do to stay safe.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Same brother. Fellow brown dude... I've been pulled over because my 'car sounded like it was being driven drunk.' Yeah, let that set in.... I didn't argue at all - I was well within my rights, but I didn't know if he gave a shit about my rights or not and his rationale for pulling me over suggested not to press my luck.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 months ago

Ah, common mistake. You accidently left your confederate flag up, so they just assumed you were driving drunk.

[–] thessnake03 21 points 3 months ago (2 children)

"Am I being detained?"

"I do not consent to any search of my person or property."

"I am exercising my right to remain silent."

"I will not answer any further questions without an attorney present."

[–] [email protected] 18 points 3 months ago

These should all be burned into everyone's brain (even if some shitheads have made "Am I being detained?" into a joke, it is still valid).

With regard to refusing to answer questions and searches:

Your right to remain silent must be actively expressed in order to exercise it. Simply being silent without active verbal exercise of that right can be interpreted as "confrontational behavior."
Depending on the circumstances, there are some questions that you are obliged to answer. If you are driving a car, you are required to produce your driver's license. You may be required to identify yourself with name and birthdate, even if you are not driving a car.
There are a couple of different kinds of search. One kind is a "pat down." This is where the officer is allowed to feel over your clothes (not inside pockets) to check for weapons, and this generally does not require any probable cause or reasonable suspicion. Any other kind of search of person or property does require probable cause, or comes after an arrest. "I do not consent to any search." If the officer is asking for your consent, they don't have cause (yet).
Be aware that you are only required to be Mirandized if the police are going to ask you questions about whatever situation they have you as a suspect or person of interest in. But you always have those rights, whether they have been read to you or not, and police may ask you questions which are "adjacent" to the situation without Mirandizing you - in the hopes that you simply offer incriminating information.

If the police want to talk to you, it's Shut the Fuck Up Day.

[–] RubberElectrons 9 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Don't forget, ridiculous as it is, you have to say "my attorney", based on https://reason.com/2011/03/08/tennessee-cops-posed-as-a-defe/

[–] [email protected] 13 points 3 months ago (4 children)

You are.

And they are also allowed to then say they smell something and bring in a dog that responds to their commands to establish a "hit" to justify searching anyway.

If its not the smell of weed, it will just be a different smell that they claim. The issue is your rejection of their search is functionally meaningless.

load more comments (4 replies)

[–] spamfajitas 9 points 3 months ago

This might not be completely true, but I was told by a former cop that technically anything obscuring the driver's view through the windshield is something they can use against you. Hanging air fresheners, bobble heads, a mounted dash cam... it's just one of those things that isn't usually enforced.

[–] dual_sport_dork 7 points 3 months ago

“Where are you going?”

Chaotic neutral: To a lecture on the 4th amendment.

Chaotic evil: Your mom's house.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 3 months ago (1 children)

you are under no obligation to tell them where you're going/have been.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Whenever I start disagreeing with an officer or telling them I don't have to answer any questions .... the response is usually that I have an attitude and that they don't like my behavior.

It's subtle intimidation because they know that if I stand up for myself long and hard enough .... they'll detain/ arrest or use force, ask questions after and justify their actions later.

It's easier to walk a fine line between complying and trying not to upset a bully with a gun.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 months ago

This is the way. In my experience it's been better to act like their friend while still being mindful of what information you're giving (strictly talking about traffic stops). But for sure if they seem to suspect you of a crime it becomes STFU Friday. It also helps to keep your hands on the wheel and be white.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 3 months ago

They'll just say they smell fentanyl and then pass out.

[–] funkyfarmington 12 points 3 months ago

Cool. Now revoke QI!

[–] [email protected] 11 points 3 months ago (2 children)

They'll just shift to "is that crack I smell?"

[–] [email protected] 6 points 3 months ago

"I don't know what crack smells like officer, but I'll defer to your personal experience."

gets face bashed in

"...almost worth it."

[–] PriorityMotif 3 points 3 months ago

Please don't talk about my body

[–] doingthestuff 2 points 3 months ago

Yeah so useful for all the people who avoid going to Illinois for all of the obvious reasons. I was born in Illinois, and don't even like to drive through there.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Are you smoking weed or am I having a stroke?

[–] M137 2 points 3 months ago

load more comments