this post was submitted on 03 Jun 2024
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MeanwhileOnGrad

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"Oh, this is calamity! Calamity! Oh no, he's on the floor!"

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Meanwhile On Grad


Documenting hate speech, conspiracy theories, apologia/revisionism, and general tankie behaviour across the fediverse. Memes are welcome!


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What I have learned:

  • Russia has already won the Ukraine war
  • Which NATO started
  • A lot of people in the West think that Ukraine should surrender
  • Also Ukraine was the world's main provider of CSAM
  • Also Ukraine is exploited by the West but if they can unite with Russia then their economy and everything else will finally be alright

It's literally like a bizarro world and everyone is over there agreeing with it. I'm genuinely confused by, who even are these people (what is the mixture of Russian bots / Russian-aligned ordinary people / confused Westerners / some other explanation.)

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[–] [email protected] 115 points 5 months ago (2 children)

There is no coherent ideology over there besides "America/the West/capitalism should be destroyed." Dudes would rather Pol Pot be in charge than Joe Biden.

[–] [email protected] 62 points 5 months ago (11 children)

Last part is true and even more insane/sad because these people are all terminally online gossip mongers that Pol Pot would have immediately executed.

You own a computer? You don't work in the fields? You wear glasses?

Yep, literally executed.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 5 months ago

Yeah, pretty much. I mean, my estimate in the modern day would be that "ACAB I saw a bad video on Youtube, we need communism" would turn into "oh my god what the FUCK they literally came in my house because I said the wrong thing online and SLAMMED ME ON THE GROUND and now they're NOT LETTING ME OUT OF PRISON this is literally SO BAD LIKE THEY'RE NOT ALLOWED TO DO THIS".

But yeah, the general principle that they don't have any degree of connection to reality with what they're saying, I'll agree with you on.

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[–] [email protected] 32 points 5 months ago (1 children)

More than once I have seen the same person express both "America is evil and the whole system needs to be destroyed" and also "Joe Biden is bad for the country and I can't support him", and asked the person, well if you think America is bad and Biden is harming the country, doesn't that mean you should support him being in charge, so he can do more damage to this evil thing?

[–] barsquid 37 points 5 months ago (2 children)

No, they know that Donald is worse for the country. They want Donald in there so America collapses faster. They want China and Russia to expand.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 5 months ago (12 children)

I don't even think they are accelerationists at this point. I think they are all either information warfare operatives or useful idiots. The hexbear admin has essentially admitted to this.

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 5 months ago (4 children)

And Hexbear gets really awkward when you call them out on wanting the Donald.

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[–] Sanctus 63 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

There is no rhyme or reason. Misinformation preys on what it can, it is an opportunist. The beliefs do not have to agree with each other so long as they affirm one's bias.

[–] [email protected] 38 points 5 months ago (22 children)

It's just so... weird.

Like it seems like they genuinely believe it. I can't see that it's useful to have a whole server of propaganda-bots all just talking to each other; it seems like probably some decent number of them are real actual people.

I feel like I have a pretty good handle at this point on why people hold weird political opinions on the internet, but the whole "Russia's the best, Russia's totally winning the war, anything and everything in the Western media is lies, RT and SCMP are the only things you can trust" viewpoint is still a mystery to me. The best thing that I can come up with is that it's a sort of little self strengthening propaganda-box like some authoritarian religions -- like "every source that doesn't agree with me is lying, don't believe them" and a few other key principles that make it hard to break your way out of once you're in it. But I don't know. Like I say I can't figure it out.

[–] SkyezOpen 28 points 5 months ago (2 children)

That's about the size of it.

World defederated from them months ago. Save yourself the psychic damage and block the instance if your instance hasn't defederated.

Or have fun and ask exactly what NATO's end game was after they "encircled" Russia and when exactly they planned to invade. Or how if Russia's goal was to prevent nato expansion, why are there 2 more NATO countries than before the war started. Or ask them to explain how the holodomor was actually not that bad and the millions of people that died deserved it.

Tankies are a mess.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 5 months ago (1 children)

It's like a sore tooth, I can't keep from poking at it.

I also learned just now that the collapse of the USSR and and its former constituent countries in the 1990s is an example of how great communism is, because when the communism went away, everything got worse. It's flawless logic; I can see no counter argument.

[–] SkyezOpen 21 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Oh the worst part you may have noticed is they'll use US atrocities to excuse other atrocities. Like they did it so why don't you care about that instead of tens of millions dead under stalin/Mao etc.? While failing to realize the actual correct position is all of that was bad. Best of luck in your adventures.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 5 months ago

Or "you think CHINA's justice system is bad, have you heard about the police in AMERICA?"

[–] [email protected] 15 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Yeah, the holodomor lol.

I had a hex person once tell me that actually the holodomor happened because of Nazi agents sabotaging agricultural production in Ukraine.

You know, in 1932 and 33. When the Nazis were putting all their resources into street fighting, barely eeking out a substantial amount of electoral power, Hitler becoming chancellor due to a compromise... you know largely before they had large numbers of party members or massive control of the state... yep they just secretly managed to sabotage the agricultural system of another state.

This person's source was literally 'I heard that...'.

I asked them for an actual source and they retreated into "Wow, way to ruin my good faith conversation attempt."

Its like they'd never actually been responsible for anything in their life, and just assumed that gossip and hear-say are totally on par with like... an actual idea with any kind of evidence.

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[–] [email protected] 60 points 5 months ago (3 children)

Hexbears can't answer the question "is it ok to kill civilians" without asking "Palestinian or Ukrainian?"

Somehow, if you say that killing children is bad regardless of religion, country or skin color, you're a racist and a Nazi.

[–] barsquid 24 points 5 months ago (2 children)

They don't care too much for Uyghur people either.

[–] Linkerbaan 15 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Had one guy claim the Uyghur concentration camps didn't exist. He posted a wall of random articles claiming there was a lack of evidence.

When asked why China is not allowing journalists near these camps and they locked it all down I got no response.

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[–] [email protected] 59 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Hexbear is generally confused by everything, so it makes sense that nothing they say makes sense.

It’s best to think of them like this:

Imagine The_Donald, but instead of it being a cesspit of right-wing ignorance, it’s a cesspit of communist ignorance.

[–] [email protected] 51 points 5 months ago (5 children)

There are some Americans, who upon learning that the US is not the mythological good guy it's propaganda portrayed it as, are dealt such severe psychic damage that the only way their fractured mind is able to cope is to just assume the opposite worldview must be true.

The key takeaway is that they're not capable of thinking for themselves. They require others to tell them what to think, and that's either going to be US or Russian propaganda.

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[–] [email protected] 49 points 5 months ago (4 children)

Block hexbear. No good comes from Hexbear, only ill.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 5 months ago (2 children)

You can block them, but there are tons of them that have lemmy.world accounts- and post regularly in the political communities.

You’ll know them when you see them.

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[–] KimjongTOOILL 15 points 5 months ago
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[–] [email protected] 44 points 5 months ago (1 children)

These people are not socialists. It's all just right wing agitprop. It's extremely obvious.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 5 months ago

The echo chamber they isolated themselves in after chapotraphouse got banned from reddit but before the great migration did not do them any favors. It's a cesspit of self ratcheting extremism.

[–] iarigby 37 points 5 months ago (13 children)

I would LOVE to find a non deranged communist forum but like I said on another comment, I have yet to encounter one which does not make me vomit all over the screen after I see them celebrating bloodshed in Ukraine and masturbating to the idea of an independent sovereign nation being crushed by brutal, authoritarian, and savage state.

It’s heartbreaking that people seeking an ideology with genuinely noble intentions turn into such violent loons. On hexbear (and co) I think they are genuinely mostly from the west but try so hard to stick it to US imperialism that they literally end up supporting a significantly more horrifying empire. I sometimes think that they deserve to have been born into Soviet Union or present Russia but I genuinely cannot bring myself to wish such horror on a human being. Their thoroughly typed and carefully cherry picked facts vs what the victims of these regimes went through have the same vibe as Tucker’s recent montage/comments about trip to Russia.

Most propaganda is grain sized, very subtle and so well masked that most people swallow without noticing it. It is structured so vaguely and discreetly that others who smell it are not able to produce hard enough evidence.

And with enough time we get the stereotypical tankie communities - gullible teenagers, bitter adults that are so blinded by search of an alternative that by endless reading they somehow achieve ignorance and betray fundamental human values, and some Russians having the time of their life having their disgusting views and evil atrocities welcomed, accepted, and spread for free.

They do not allow discussions, but the Russian propaganda that gets spread on other servers or social media cost them nothing emotionally while all of us who have to argue back need to resurface feelings that we suffer under Russia’s terrorism, after inheriting the generational trauma from parents born into Soviet Union.

[–] olafurp 15 points 5 months ago

I agree, they simply put all the blame on the West for the world's problems no matter what it is and to be fair I often agree with those statements.

It's just purely idiotic to support another country going the same thing and denying facts such as Russia invaded Ukraine.

I'm a socialist, somewhat left of a standard social democrat in the EU, but fuck, these guys are giving the whole ideology a bad name. There are still some recent movements that are good such as solarpunk, degrowth, minimalism, third spaces and tool libraries. I hope the Gen Z and Alpha get in on those so they can vote out our generation of rampant consumerism and privatisation.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 5 months ago (9 children)

slrpnk.net seems to have some genuine socialist / communist ideology without the tankie flavor. They have a couple of users who I think are pretty effective "and that's why Emma Goldman would be okay with letting Trump come to power!" shills, but for the most part it's just the good stuff. IMO.

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[–] [email protected] 30 points 5 months ago

I assume hexbear is just the russian troll factory.

I can read Russian and I sometimes read Russian media and it uses almost exactly the same topics for their people. There is a new one that they started to repeat recently and it's that Zelensky is an illegitimate president, because his term has ened.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Insert wall of giant wall of "clever" one picture replies here<

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 5 months ago

Useful idiots and shills, they are.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 5 months ago (5 children)

This thread makes me laugh.

They're getting their knickers in a twist thinking that Biden is escalating and would be the cause for a nuclear war, conveniently forgetting that:

  • Russia invaded Ukraine
  • Russia has been constantly making threats to use nuclear weapons against western nations since the invasion started
  • Russia attacks Ukraine from within their own borders
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[–] [email protected] 22 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I completely forgot I blocked Hexbear. Looks like I made a good decision.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 5 months ago

It seems that tankies support Putin.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 5 months ago

thank you for succinctly articulating an echo of my experience recently on lemmy.ml

They are very ...passionate... about their ideals I guess.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (7 children)

That is the power of an echo chamber. My favorite post by a hex was when he tried to convince me that the Tiananmen Square massare was fake. He had a comprehensive list of over 20 links prepared, with bangers like "Actually, the massacre wasn't happening on Tiananmen Square, but next to it. Checkmate globalists". I'd love to link it here, but shame on @goat for deleting that post and sending them to the Tankie corner, because now I can't find it anymore, not even in the mod log.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 5 months ago

Oh, you forgot the "Ukraine is 90% nazis" part

[–] [email protected] 17 points 5 months ago (1 children)

These takes are pretty hot with QAnon conservatives in America too. Wonder why. 🤔

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[–] taiyang 17 points 5 months ago

Whoa, I should not have hit that link.

Those guys are loons, and now I feel like I'm on a list for seeing that conversation, haha.

[–] mojofrododojo 17 points 5 months ago

Trying to make tankies make sense is a losing vocation mate. bizarro world is right.

[–] MehBlah 14 points 5 months ago

Stupidity is easy to see and trying to understand it is pointless.

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