this post was submitted on 27 Jul 2023
143 points (99.3% liked)
Canada
7206 readers
317 users here now
What's going on Canada?
Communities
🍁 Meta
🗺️ Provinces / Territories
- Alberta
- British Columbia
- Manitoba
- New Brunswick
- Newfoundland and Labrador
- Northwest Territories
- Nova Scotia
- Nunavut
- Ontario
- Prince Edward Island
- Quebec
- Saskatchewan
- Yukon
🏙️ Cities / Local Communities
- Calgary (AB)
- Edmonton (AB)
- Greater Sudbury (ON)
- Halifax (NS)
- Hamilton (ON)
- Kootenays (BC)
- London (ON)
- Mississauga (ON)
- Montreal (QC)
- Nanaimo (BC)
- Oceanside (BC)
- Ottawa (ON)
- Port Alberni (BC)
- Regina (SK)
- Saskatoon (SK)
- Thunder Bay (ON)
- Toronto (ON)
- Vancouver (BC)
- Vancouver Island (BC)
- Victoria (BC)
- Waterloo (ON)
- Winnipeg (MB)
🏒 Sports
Hockey
- List of All Teams: Post on /c/hockey
- General Community: /c/Hockey
- Calgary Flames
- Edmonton Oilers
- Montréal Canadiens
- Ottawa Senators
- Toronto Maple Leafs
- Vancouver Canucks
- Winnipeg Jets
Football (NFL)
- List of All Teams:
unknown
Football (CFL)
- List of All Teams:
unknown
Baseball
- List of All Teams:
unknown - Toronto Blue Jays
Basketball
- List of All Teams:
unknown - Toronto Raptors
Soccer
- List of All Teams:
unknown - General Community: /c/CanadaSoccer
- Toronto FC
💻 Universities
💵 Finance / Shopping
- Personal Finance Canada
- BAPCSalesCanada
- Canadian Investor
- Buy Canadian
- Quebec Finance
- Churning Canada
🗣️ Politics
- Canada Politics
- General:
- By Province:
🍁 Social and Culture
Rules
Reminder that the rules for lemmy.ca also apply here. See the sidebar on the homepage:
founded 3 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
It would be unwise to not have a backup heat source if you're installing a heat pump in Canada. Some may claim their balance point is well into the -20s, but relying on a system that cannot provide adequate heat in extreme cold events could get rather dangerous.
As for the offsetting NG furnaces, it's unlikely someone would remove the furnace when the heat pump can easily be installed in the air handler, in line with the furnace, and a 'dual-fuel' thermostat used to control the switch point.
Here in Saskatchewan, NG is also significantly cheaper than electricity. So, with our high heating demands, those who have access to NG often choose that. I have a heat pump and electric furnace backup, but I'm in a net-zero house designed for significantly lower energy use, which is definitely an outlier to the typical terribly designed homes built to minimum code.
As always, in all things, solicit advice from a pro. Conditions will vary wildly between Vancouver, Regina, StJohns and Sarnia.
I have 3 sources. Heat pump, oil furnace, and oven.
I was "use the oven to heat part of the house" kind of poor, once. ;-)
My new heat pump works perfectly fine down to -30C, but it's a very new model. And for the few times a year it gets that bad, use a space heater.
Cries in Edmontonian
Every time the carbon tax goes up, the gap between electric and natural gas closes.
But heat pumps are much more efficient than electric heating and a much cheaper source of heat.
Unless you're in Saskatchewan, where both utilities increase because we burn natural gas and coal for power.
It makes sense, because they burn gas to make the electricity. I understand a heat pump can create a lot more heat than just an element would, though, so it still comes out cheaper.
I hear there's work being done to make more cold-resistant ones. For myself, I wonder about the ground-loop systems. They're more expensive, but I don't know by how much.
Running heat pump isn't cheaper than NG in Saskatchewan. Natural gas is about 9x cheaper than electricity for the same amount of energy. A heat pump also doesn't create heat, it only moves it. It can be over 300% efficient, but natural gas is still cheaper to heat the same space.
Ground loop (geothermal) is significantly more expensive to install and also needs to be designed properly or it will remove the available heat from the ground in just a decade.
Well, yeah, any HVAC system needs to be properly designed.
Not sure this should be downvoted, I'm guessing this guy knows his local prices, and the rest sounds right or just is right.
I don't know why either. It's part of my job to know these things, but I'm happy to reassess if anyone has information that contradicts what I've said.
More expensive to install, and may not be possible in a normal city lot.
But there are situations when it is the sinning choice. My brother did a new house build on a rural property about 10 years ago and went with a ground source system (with supplemental electric heat for the coldest days in those cold Manitoba winters). The incremental cost was not that much, since the had the space for the outdoor loop, and had the construction equipment already on-site.
He is very happy with it.
Ground loops are a great choice if it is an option since the ground loop is often on the right side of the equation, cooler than air in the summer and warmer than air in the winter.
I mean you're in SK, that's kind of an extreme case. Most Canadians live in parts of the country with more moderate weather, where it only goes below -20 on the absolute coldest night of the year, if at all. I mean "backup" could just mean a couple of 1500 watt space heaters in the closet if you find the pump isn't cutting it - yes you'll burn through your heating bill but it's going to be for maybe a couple of nights tops.
Ottawa has weeks at a time where it's below -20? I think the GTA is similar. The past two winters here in NS we've had to have our baseboard heaters on in addition to our heat pumps multiple times through the winters because it was much colder than -20?
In Manitoba (which gets the same or worse winters as Sask) heat pumps can make sense.
But that's because our electricity is much less expensive.
Yup. Hooray for plentiful hydro! I always think it's funny how MB gets grouped into the petro-provinces as The West on environmental arguments you're not part of the carbon-intensive area of Canada. (edit: wrong abbrev.)