this post was submitted on 22 Jan 2024
378 points (98.0% liked)
Technology
60021 readers
3355 users here now
This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.
Our Rules
- Follow the lemmy.world rules.
- Only tech related content.
- Be excellent to each another!
- Mod approved content bots can post up to 10 articles per day.
- Threads asking for personal tech support may be deleted.
- Politics threads may be removed.
- No memes allowed as posts, OK to post as comments.
- Only approved bots from the list below, to ask if your bot can be added please contact us.
- Check for duplicates before posting, duplicates may be removed
Approved Bots
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Why not just ban smartphones in school? There's ample research now that they're harmful to teen mental health
Add phone functionality to their guns?
https://youtu.be/rFtW419VwtY
Got you covered
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://piped.video/rFtW419VwtY
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.
For anyone that doesn't know, Forgotten Weapons YouTube channel is one of the best channels relating to guns. But it's a historical, educational persepective on guns, mostly guns from WW1,WWII, and anything up until the 1980s, though he does deal with some rare and some modern guns from time to time. Overall it's a fantastic channel, the main guy Ian breaks down a guns history, mechanics, how it handled in production or war time, he really does his research, so it's not your typical "I like muh guns big and loud" type of channel, it's legit informative and educational, 100% check him out if you have the slightest interest in guns and gun history.
Flip phones.
You don't. You die like everybody else, without saying goodbye.
They could just watch on the security cameras. I'm pretty sure they exist in every class and parents can access them at any time.
There aren’t security cameras in classrooms, at least in the schools I’ve worked. They are in the hallways though. I wasn’t allowed to record my class (despite that being good practice - watching yourself teach!)
I know a few schools in my area tried to institute zero tolerance no phones rule and the screaming from parents was loud enough that they gave up. One of the big sticking points was because of school shootings. Another was that schools have been bad about getting kids on the bus, that kids are getting lost or even ending up in bus depots at the end of the day.
I think a good middle ground might be to ban smartphones but not phones entirely. If you want your kid to be able to call you, buy them a nokia or something without internet capabilities
I mean the real reason is that parents are almost as bad as their kids with their phones. They have become accustomed to texting their children throughout the day.
Wow, that is eye opening. I can't imagine how bad helicopter parents can be these days....
There are better tools these days than blanket prohibition.
The signals that voice and data go over are different from each other, so not all modern cellphone jammers jam the entire spectrum. Some can be set up to allow voice calls over the traditional channels while jamming data. This forces students to use the school’s wifi network for any Internet connectivity, whereupon their connectivity to apps and services can be whitelisted/blacklisted as deemed necessary by system admins.
Ergo, a system that keeps students off of their smartphones while allowing parental connectivity.
Yeah, because schools have thousands of dollars to spend on high-end cellphone jammers when they can't even pay their teachers a decent wage.
Imagine jamming cell signal then an emergency happens. Oh the liability payout would be massive. And they say schools are underfunded now.
I feel that might be an issue from 4G onwards, considering VoLTE and VoNR are intended to avoid the use of a separate voice network to their existing data network
I proposed a Faraday cage once 😂. But running a jammer would be a good way to get the FCC involved (hint: massively illegal). And if you think dealing with the FCC is fun, ask your local ham operator…
Also they all know how to find proxies or unblocked sites. I watched severely intellectually disabled children teach other out to install VPNs. The smarter ones could install shit like Dolphin and would be playing Pokémon in class.
How do you only allow parent connectivity without allowing most everything else? Would this require schools to build an app specifically for them to allow through and make parents and kids use that? It sounds awful for everyone involved. A mildly determined and clever kid would probably be able to figure out how to circumvent the censorship anyways, and now you’re back at square one but with a bunch of useless infrastructure to maintain.
Most smartphones allow os level VPN, that will get around this.
How many VPNs are running on ports that’d be allowed? Schools can easily restrict wifi to only allow 443 through a MITM proxy and 80 (which firewalls can easily inspect and drop TLS connections.)
You can get VPNs that run over websocket connections.
You can't solve behavioural issues purely with technology.
You'll be so popular, with your dictator-like censorship of an organisation! How come no one even treats children like people, you wouldn't find it acceptable to jam the mobile data of adults' phones. Talk to the kids and encourage them to want to work at school, don't be autocratic.
Because no one wants to deal with parents.
The children don't count, clearly. Only adult opinions matter.
This but unironically. In my neck of the woods, we are hemorrhaging kids to private or charter. That means losing money. Superintendents and administrators view parents as customers. They don’t want a parent to get pissed and move districts because the dollars follow the students. If education is babysitting - if a teacher allows students to do nothing but watch videos on their phone - parents hear nothing and assume everything is fine. If a teacher is calling home about behavioral issues, or a school has “high” discipline rates, then that becomes a visible issue.
You can’t take them, because the district is worried they’ll get sued if one breaks. Your option is to tell the parent, and the parent will 80% come up with some bullshit excuse or accuse you of targeting their child. I worked one district that had a form we could fill out - after getting caught three times they were supposed to turn the phone in. Never happened.
Please. Do. Not. Send. Your. Child. To. School. With. A. Smartphone. DONT.
They are addicted. We’ve given them tech that adults can’t even manage to responsibly use. They don’t know how to be bored or curious. The behavior is just strange - when I’ve been fuck it and just taken a phone - they regress. 15 year olds babbling and throwing tantrums like toddlers.
Id feel safer sending my kid to school without a smartphone if I wasn't scared there would be a school shooting or some other reason my kid would need to call me for help. I get the sense a lot of other parents feel that way too.
My kids are still too young for that but when they are in high school and maybe depending on the middle school I'll probably start thinking about a phone of some kind.
Also my kids are bored all the time haha. Taking away their tablet or games is the best punishment most of the time when they argue. We are big on drawing over here though. Hard to stop a kid from drawing lol.
In a school shooting situation, cell phones could make things much worse. During my active shooter training, we were told to ask students to turn them off if we were in a shooting. The noise is an obvious danger, but the lines need to be kept clear for communication with emergency response personnel. There would be structured ways that the school would want to communicate with you - they don’t want the chaos of parents showing up to an active scene. I think it would be better to rely on things like the Rave app.
In other situations, the front office is there. That is the function that they have served for generations. Give the office aides something to do.
There’s just little reason for students to have smart phones in school. They cannot control themselves. We are asking them to have more self restraint than most adults do. It is not developmentally appropriate and it is harmful.
When I was a kid, there were pay phones so that kids could make calls for when they wanted to be picked up. And we had landline at home so that if you needed to make a call, you could.
Those things don't really exist anymore. And now we have phones with apps that monitor medical conditions like diabetes. Let's single out those kids?
So make the office staff stay after hours so that the kids with after school activities can make a phone call? Yeah, because fuck the school staff, right?
The horse has already left the gate. You're not going to get it back.
504s exist for kids who need them for medical purposes. (Had a diabetic kid - her mom made sure she knew the phone was only for monitoring) While there aren’t pay phones; there is a landline in the office at every school that students will be able to use.
The office workers are hourly and are already scheduled to stay for at least an hour after school. That’s part of their job.
At my school there was an office phone outside the office that anyone could use. No need to staff it.
Good luck banning them from schools
I spent 12 years in American public school during which greater than 70% of the student body had cell or smart phones and 100% of them were successfully banned. If the phone is visible during the school day and you aren't currently receiving a phone call from the President or from your parents on their way to the hospital, phone goes in the teacher's desk. You get it back at the end of the day.
Its not that difficult at all.
they kinda are Ireland, in primary school mostly but even in secondary school teachers are allowed to take your phone for 3 days if they see you on it
What's the difficulty? If they're being used they're out in the open, and if they're out in the open they can be confiscated.
Is there research consensus on when children should be given phones? I would personally be very conservative about it, honestly.
I agree! There's a campaign pushing to avoid giving kids phones until 8th grade, but I think even that seems a bit too young
Good luck with that, the highschool I went to had a hard enough time getting students to stop vaping at school and during class, smartphones would be a much bigger battle. I graduated in 2019 and I still remember when they would try to crack down on cell phone use, never really affected me that much cause I only ever used my phone during class if I was done with everything but I still saw it go the same way every time. It would always only ever last for a month or two before the teachers just gave up because in the end if someone doesn't wanna pay attention during class taking away their distraction isn't gonna make them. They'll just find some other distraction like talking to people or just zoning out. The problem is school just isn't engaging and sure you can blame cell phones and social media for making it harder for people to pay attention to things that they don't wanna do. But that doesn't mean the solution is to not allow them during school, cause I've seen from experience that doesn't help even if you manage to take away the phones, which already is really hard without impacting students who are following the rules negatively.
Man I remember being in school and a cellphone or pager was instant suspension.