You suckers! Everyday I travel through time. I have been keeping a steady pace of 24 hours per day for decades!
this post was submitted on 29 Jan 2025
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TenForward: Where Every Vulcan Knows Your Name
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Vulcan Science Directorate:
Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations
Also Vulcan Science Directorate:
Here's a fixed set of approved combinations
America:
Land of the free! Freedom freedom freedom
Also America:
...unless you're not a white straight christian male always wearing at least 1 piece of gear with an American flag on it and your vehicle has some sort of back the thin blue line decal.
Cue Founding Father Lionel Hutz:
"Oh no. Those printers messed this all up.
It's supposed to be 'Land of the fee, home of the slave.'
Better remove this Bar Logo."
< Chomp chomp >
I love how also they had warp for a significant amount of years before humans but didnt see half the stuff Archer saw on his first mission.
It shows how conservative they were with the technology (probably because Romulan wartime policy affected exploration)
me of
Despite all the talk about logic and discovery, Vulcans (at least when well written) are mostly motivated by fear. Even their strong adherence to logic is motivated by what they perceive as their violent nature because of their past.
I think that starting to move past that is why T'rina is less "robotic" than TOS and TNG era Vulcans, and why she's actually more logical than most Vulcans we saw.
There's a reason humans are an important part of the federation, and it's not because they are the smartest. They are the crazy fuckers who do whatever insane thing comes to mind just to see what will happen.
For those that haven't seen it: The United Federation of Hold My Beer
The Vulcan science directorate has determined that time travel is...unfair.
Just tell the science directorate that all you have to do is fly a rickety warbird real fast around a star. Then you turn into an early 3d rendering demo and, boom, you're ready to hear Frankie tell you to relax before you know it.
“T’Pol.”
“T’Pol.”
“T’Pol.”
*sighs* “Captain?”
“T’Pol how do you know I didn’t just leap here?”
Oh boy.
The Vulcans are so focused on their logic they forget the universe is not rational. Even logic isn't fully rational!
The ENT Vulcans aren't very rational.
More emotional than an andorian, that's for sure.
As a group, they are.
Vulcans: everything has a logical explanation.
Quantum physics: exists
But isn't our understanding of quantum physics predicated on logical and provable mathematical models?
Also, I gotta point out that this is a Sci-Fi setting with superluminal travel, which is also supposed to be (practically speaking) impossible. A different kind of problem to be sure. But at some point it feels like the real unlimited power of the Federation is just realizing the fantasies of nerds from the 1970s.
Technically speaking, they never travel faster than light, since they bend the spacetime continuum so that light could always travel faster than they do.
Instead, they travel faster inside that warped space than light would have traveled in non-warped space, but they don't travel faster than the light can inside the warped space.
Yes and no. There’s a boundary where we can do math that says what might happen, but we can’t test those hypotheses. At least that’s my understanding.
What I was referring to is Goedel’s incompleteness theorem which says that in a logic system there are things that are true that cannot be proven in the system, and logic systems can become complex enough that you can’t prove they’re consistent.
So it’s not really saying logic is illogical, but it is saying in logic you sometimes have to build on foundations you can’t prove to be true, despite believing very strongly that they are.
What I was referring to is Goedel’s incompleteness theorem which says that in a logic system there are things that are true that cannot be proven in the system, and logic systems can become complex enough that you can’t prove they’re consistent.
If you get into the real guts of the theorem, the limit becomes a system attempting to describe itself.
But there's plenty of room for logical analysis outside the artificially engineered naval gazing that Goedel uses to prove incompleteness.
in logic you sometimes have to build on foundations you can’t prove to be true, despite believing very strongly that they are.
In logic, you do have certain unprovable truths known as axioms, which you use to form the foundation of a model. And one way to evaluate a model is to try and prove statements that force one axiom to contradict another (typically referred to as a paradox).
"Time Travel is impossible" is a conclusion we can make IRL, but not one that holds in a narrative fantasy.
No time travel? Uh, don't tell that to Gary.
Archer: “I think you put it over the top.”
T’Pal: “I still don’t believe in time travel.”
Archer: Woody Woodpecker noises