this post was submitted on 11 Sep 2023
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[–] MataVatnik 169 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Equating Israel to Judaism is such a stupid fucking idea.

[–] FlyingSquid 81 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I'm really, really tired of immediately denouncing Israel half the time people find out I'm Jewish. I'm not a fucking Israeli.

[–] [email protected] 66 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The Israeli government is really happy to rope you and all other Jewish people outside of Israel along though. And too many unfortunately play that role happily.

[–] FlyingSquid 13 points 1 year ago (3 children)

And too many unfortunately play that role happily.

See? This is what I mean. If I just announced that I was Jewish to someone like you, you'd make me justify it by denouncing Israel. I shouldn't have to do that. It should not be assumed that just because I'm a Jew, I support Israel. Frankly, that's a form of racism.

[–] qevlarr 43 points 1 year ago (1 children)

They're saying you should blame Israel for that, not random people trying to find out who's who

[–] FlyingSquid 15 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Why not blame both? Why should they be trying to find out who's who. If you found out someone was Turkish, would you immediately ask them if they supported Erdogan? If someone was Hungarian, would you try to find out if they supported Orban?

I don't know if you're an American, but how would you like it if, every time you met a non-American, you would have to announce that you don't support Trump because they're trying to "find out who's who?"

[–] [email protected] 34 points 1 year ago (19 children)

As an American, Trump is the first thing many of my European friends talk about

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 year ago

how would you like it if, every time you met a non-American, you would have to announce that you don’t support Trump because they’re trying to “find out who’s who?”

This is already the case.

[–] jarfil 20 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (4 children)

Isn't that how it works anyway?

Person A: "I am a [whatever]"

Person B: "What do you think of [some thing about "whatever" I've recently seen on TV, and is possibly the only thing I know about it]?"

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago

The Israeli government doesn't even represent all Israelis, let alone all Jews. Does represent the vast majority unfortunately

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I dont mean you personally, but organizations that claim to represent the jewish people in various countries. For instance the American Jewish Committee that claims Jews critisizing Israel would be antisemites and tries to have the UN comittees dissolved that adress the human rights situation in Palestine. Or a bit larger but slightly more moderate the World Jewish Congress, that wants "to enhance solidarity among Jewish communities throughout the world and, recognizing the centrality of the State of Israel to contemporary Jewish identity, to strengthen the bonds of Jewish communities and Jews in the Diaspora with Israel"

These organizations claim to represent Jewish people around the world and that they would be in favor of Israel and support Israel, especially in face of criticism.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Jewish_Committee https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Jewish_Congress

[–] FlyingSquid 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Sure, and white supremacists claim to represent all white people. They don't and no one should assume that just because you're white, you're a white supremacist.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 year ago (27 children)

Which i never did. You cannot deny the reality, that many Jewish people and organizations want to tie all Jewish people to Israel. It is the predominant view in the larger organizations, that are often recognized as spokespeople for the Jewish community in the respective country, continent or world.

I also find it wrong, that Israel is claiming to be representative of the Jewish people as a whole and having a lot of organized support for it. The voices to the contrary need to organize and make themselves heard.

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[–] aidan 23 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

The issue is that both antiseminites and Zionists do want Jewish to mean Israeli. Same with being Israeli doesn't mean your Jewish or a Zionist

[–] [email protected] 66 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Nah, it a brilliant idea if you want to deflect criticism of Israel's right-wing government. What's stupid is believing it.

[–] MataVatnik 23 points 1 year ago

Oh, from that perspective is genius. But any moron that buys into it should be ridiculed

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

Same thing with equating abortions to baby murder. Great branding, horrible belief.