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this post was submitted on 09 Aug 2024
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Its likely too early (For Wikipedia) just because the ICJ hasn't made a ruling. The genocide however is pretty plain to see and has been all year. Wikipedia has always done weird and often inconsistent things around the evidence allowed and sufficient to support statements in its articles so its not a new issue.
The ICJ ruling will take years though.
I think the most similar genocide to the Gaza genocide is the Bosnian genocide. The Srebrenica massacre took place in 1995 and the ICJ ruled in 2007.
So, the Gaza genocide might take until 2035 before it is all legally settled.
In the interim, Wikipedia and all of us need to decide what to call it.
Since it looks like a genocide and the initial findings support the case that genocide is likely being committed, it seems to border on genocide denial to call it anything else.
Edit to add: I also don't see people complaining about Wikipedia calling the Rohingya genocide a genocide, even though it is legally in the same phase as the Gaza genocide.
Walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, shits like a duck. Probably a duck.
Totally okay with calling it a genocide- and while they dither on what a slow-as-fuck court says, people are dying en masse.
Israel is starving the population, bombing them, shooting them, blockading them, it has destroyed all the medical facilities, educational institutions, all the infrastructure, it has cut off electricity and water and blocks or kills anyone trying to help the people to live. Israeli leaders openly express genocidal intent. There's no doubt this is genocide.
In ponds?
Kidding aside, it's ABSOLUTELY a genocide. There's no doubt about it by any credible definition.
That Wikipedia has started calling it a genocide is a much needed step that removes one of the few remaining straws that Hasbarists and other genocide deniers have left to grasp at.
As far as genocide deniers are concerned, that's the idea.
i mean, we could also just not have started referring to it as a genocide, but uh, we jumped the gun there a little bit.
It's always interesting to me how people will latch on to certain words so aggressively and refuse to cede even minor ground if it requires changing wording.
i mean even referring to it as "likely genocide" would make it like 10x more palatable.
Removed, civility.
curious, i'm not jewish, how could i be a zionist?
ethno-nationalist maybe, but i'm not one of those either, i'm generally opposed to ethnostates.
also, am i gross? Or did i just say something gross? Weird implication there.
Oh wow it's super fucking rare for someone to just admit that they've got no idea what they're talking about like that.
If you legitimately think being Jewish is a requirement to be a zionist then you're so I'll informed on the topic at hand that it's actually pathetic.
Yes. Your views are gross, so I find you gross.
There's no implication at all, I directly stated what you are. Work on your understanding of the language, it's shit.
well considering that zionism is a concept relating specifically to judaism, it seems fair to me to assume that it would be mostly jewish people that primarily care about it.
My family is historically christian, but i'm not a pastor or anything so any deeper lore is lost on me.
i don't think it's a requirement, probably just a heavy predisposition. As a non religious individual myself i have no reason to care for zionism one way or the other. I also don't think i mentioned anything specifically about zionism in my original post, so im not even sure why i'm being called a zionist.
all of them? Or just these ones specifically.
Their comment was removed for civility, but to answer your question, many American evangelicals are Zionist because they feel the Holy land has to be in Jewish hands for Jesus to come back.
It's not a rational belief, but then, religion is rarely rational.
yeah, that's a possibility. I know israel exists under the concept that in order for jews to be safe it has to be it's own ethnostate with the ability to protect itself militarily, which is definitely one of the answers after the events of the holocaust. Or so i've heard.
appreciate the answer though.
They relied on academics and genocide experts. It's not weird or inconsistent with reality, regardless of propaganda.
Yeah, they're inconsistent from article to article, because it depends on how many editors show up.
The more editors generally means a more consistent result/accurate result.
Yeah. One time I edited the Wikipedia article on the human pancreas to say it was just a worthless organ taking up valuable internal real estate. My edit got redacted pretty quickly.
It has never been an organ of distinction