Waiting for the tankards to twist themselves in knots explaining this one
this post was submitted on 28 Sep 2023
215 points (99.1% liked)
World News
38976 readers
2017 users here now
A community for discussing events around the World
Rules:
-
Rule 1: posts have the following requirements:
- Post news articles only
- Video links are NOT articles and will be removed.
- Title must match the article headline
- Not United States Internal News
- Recent (Past 30 Days)
- Screenshots/links to other social media sites (Twitter/X/Facebook/Youtube/reddit, etc.) are explicitly forbidden, as are link shorteners.
-
Rule 2: Do not copy the entire article into your post. The key points in 1-2 paragraphs is allowed (even encouraged!), but large segments of articles posted in the body will result in the post being removed. If you have to stop and think "Is this fair use?", it probably isn't. Archive links, especially the ones created on link submission, are absolutely allowed but those that avoid paywalls are not.
-
Rule 3: Opinions articles, or Articles based on misinformation/propaganda may be removed. Sources that have a Low or Very Low factual reporting rating or MBFC Credibility Rating may be removed.
-
Rule 4: Posts or comments that are homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-religious, or ableist will be removed. “Ironic” prejudice is just prejudiced.
-
Posts and comments must abide by the lemmy.world terms of service UPDATED AS OF 10/19
-
Rule 5: Keep it civil. It's OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It's NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
-
Rule 6: Memes, spam, other low effort posting, reposts, misinformation, advocating violence, off-topic, trolling, offensive, regarding the moderators or meta in content may be removed at any time.
-
Rule 7: We didn't USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you're posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
Lemmy World Partners
News [email protected]
Politics [email protected]
World Politics [email protected]
Recommendations
For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/
- Consider including the article’s mediabiasfactcheck.com/ link
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
Am I supposed to think a government holding the people running businesses (apparently very poorly in this case) accountable for their actions is a bad thing?
The question is are they being held accountable for doing something illegal, or are they being prosecuted for running a business poorly? One is good, the other is overreach.
Then again, considering how deeply involved the CCP is with large Chinese businesses this could be seen as a completely internal issue.
Chinese government overreach? Surely hell has frozen over /s
I guess both given the massive scale of the business and its massive impacts on the whole economy is reasonable
A bit too late for that isnt it? Chinese government has been propping up ghost shit building for years and now that shit is going down and all of their pockets are full they drop some scapegoats. You just can't lose as an authoritarian huh.
A public statement “z is detained for y” is generally expected compared to the usual “no one has seen x from china lately, they probably got held by the govt”
I definitely can applaud their government for potentially holding them accountable. However they’re not arrested yet, and more importantly it’s not like this was a secret or fraud per se. We’ve been hearing about China’s “ghost cities” for a number of years now. Buildings built without people in them, buildings half built or only the shell to look complete, and that’s through media that’s allowed to escape their walled garden of information. To me there’s no way that even Xi himself didn’t know that Evergande or Country Garden wasn’t out defrauding the average Chinese citizen. So while good on them for putting them under surveillance today, it’s also terrible of them to have let this gone on.
I’m also an American though so my information may be limited on this subject matter since I’m not a focused person on one country or field.
The problem with using ghost cities as a metric is that China has a lot of pent up demand to urbanize and those cities would get filled within a few years. That pent up demand is what led to a generation of growth.
However, the plan works until it doesn't.
China seems to have hit a limit on growth and that limit seems correlated to population growth instead of COVID. Worse, housing investment is a key way that people save for retirement. Even worse, municipalities and provinces can't raise their own taxes, so they've been incentivized to keep building even as the national government has been trying to put the breaks on the economy.
There might have been some criminal malfeasance, but there is also a failure of public policy from the national level down. Part of it may be why Xi has become more autocratic in the past few years; the party is going through its first recession in a generation and this is new ground for them.
Well, a significant part of this can be resolved nicely by creating a comprehensive welfare system. Just off the top of my head - buy out the apartments purchased as investment and provide good pensions in their place. Then people won't feel the need to participate in this failing market and won't be affected of its potential collapse. I've been wondering why there's no proper welfare system in China and I recently stumbled upon info that Xi believes welfare makes people lazy. So that's a problem. If I were a Chinese citizen whose bought into the social contract with the CCP, I'd expect the construction of a good welfare system out of it.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Shares in crisis-hit Chinese property giant Evergrande have been suspended in Hong Kong amid reports its chairman has been placed under police surveillance.
When the firm defaulted on its huge debts in 2021, it sent shockwaves through global financial markets as the property sector contributes to roughly a quarter of China's economy.
A credit crunch would be very bad news for the world's second largest economy, because companies that can't borrow find it difficult to grow, and in some cases are unable to continue operating.
Then on Wednesday, Bloomberg News reported the firm's founder Hui Ka Yan, who is also known as Xu Jiayin, had been taken away by police this month and was being monitored at a designated location.
"China's property-sector stress will continue to pose cross-sector credit risks in the near term," wrote Lan Wang and Duncan Innes-Ker of Fitch Ratings.
"The government's modest policy easing to date is unlikely to drive a sharp turnaround in homebuyers' sentiment, even though it has led to some recent improvements in broader economic indicators," their report said.
The original article contains 646 words, the summary contains 176 words. Saved 73%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
The company lost 99% evaluation and its shares lost most of its value. Soon this's going to effect more than China's economy