this post was submitted on 04 Mar 2025
77 points (97.5% liked)

No Stupid Questions

37778 readers
1845 users here now

No such thing. Ask away!

!nostupidquestions is a community dedicated to being helpful and answering each others' questions on various topics.

The rules for posting and commenting, besides the rules defined here for lemmy.world, are as follows:

Rules (interactive)


Rule 1- All posts must be legitimate questions. All post titles must include a question.

All posts must be legitimate questions, and all post titles must include a question. Questions that are joke or trolling questions, memes, song lyrics as title, etc. are not allowed here. See Rule 6 for all exceptions.



Rule 2- Your question subject cannot be illegal or NSFW material.

Your question subject cannot be illegal or NSFW material. You will be warned first, banned second.



Rule 3- Do not seek mental, medical and professional help here.

Do not seek mental, medical and professional help here. Breaking this rule will not get you or your post removed, but it will put you at risk, and possibly in danger.



Rule 4- No self promotion or upvote-farming of any kind.

That's it.



Rule 5- No baiting or sealioning or promoting an agenda.

Questions which, instead of being of an innocuous nature, are specifically intended (based on reports and in the opinion of our crack moderation team) to bait users into ideological wars on charged political topics will be removed and the authors warned - or banned - depending on severity.



Rule 6- Regarding META posts and joke questions.

Provided it is about the community itself, you may post non-question posts using the [META] tag on your post title.

On fridays, you are allowed to post meme and troll questions, on the condition that it's in text format only, and conforms with our other rules. These posts MUST include the [NSQ Friday] tag in their title.

If you post a serious question on friday and are looking only for legitimate answers, then please include the [Serious] tag on your post. Irrelevant replies will then be removed by moderators.



Rule 7- You can't intentionally annoy, mock, or harass other members.

If you intentionally annoy, mock, harass, or discriminate against any individual member, you will be removed.

Likewise, if you are a member, sympathiser or a resemblant of a movement that is known to largely hate, mock, discriminate against, and/or want to take lives of a group of people, and you were provably vocal about your hate, then you will be banned on sight.



Rule 8- All comments should try to stay relevant to their parent content.



Rule 9- Reposts from other platforms are not allowed.

Let everyone have their own content.



Rule 10- Majority of bots aren't allowed to participate here.



Credits

Our breathtaking icon was bestowed upon us by @Cevilia!

The greatest banner of all time: by @TheOneWithTheHair!

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

Are they basically just there to shoot down the plane before causes larger casualties by crashing into a heavily populated area? I can't imagine what else a jet can do to a large commercial aircraft in the air.

top 28 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] ThePyroPython 52 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

I can only speak for the UK and from a amateur perspective but here's the rough breakdown:

90% of the time it's likely a private pilot that's wandered into a restricted airspace without realising it. Or a faulty radio or navigation equipment or a medical emergency. They're politely escorted out.

9.9999% of the time is an adversarial nation testing the response time of the quick-reaction force defenses. They're politely but forcefully escorted out. Maybe some insults traded over the radio but that'd be about as heated as it gets.

0.0001% they pose a threat and refuse to be escorted out. At that point it's basically the same thing of asking "what would happen if someone climbed the fence to the White House and towards it and when the secret service pointed guns at them didn't stop, would they get shot?"

It's the pilot's call at that point, but if they posed a threat to life then yes they probably would shoot them down.

Edit: there's probably a ridiculous amount of zeros I'd need to add to the last point to indicate how unlikely it is but I can't be arsed to add that many. Basically you might as well round down to 0%

[–] [email protected] 5 points 13 hours ago (1 children)
[–] glinncor 5 points 10 hours ago (1 children)

I hate that I understand the reference

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 hours ago

I don't get it

[–] Hugin 16 points 23 hours ago (2 children)

So on 9/11 the fighters scrambled to intercept United 91 had no weapons installed. There were no orders but one of the two pilots sad the plan was to ram the cockpit bringing down the both their plane and the passenger plane.

I'll add that very few fighter pilots will ever scramble a plane. There is a large checklist pilots go through before taking off particularly a fighter. When a fighter is scrambled that's all skipped.

[–] lemming741 10 points 15 hours ago (1 children)

It's crazy they scrambled with zero offensive capabilities back then. Not even the 20mm cannon was loaded.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 11 hours ago

They weren't scrambled if I remember correctly. They were airborne for a training mission and closer than the scrambled jets were. That's why they had no munitions

Source: Talked to a pilot who's instructor was one of those pilots

[–] [email protected] 5 points 15 hours ago

United 91

*93

[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 day ago (2 children)

From what I’ve heard from my coworker do actually flew:

Step 1: Attempt radio contact on local frequencies and guard.

Step 2: Try to lead you out of restricted air space

Step 3: Try to REALLY get your attention like doing precision fly so that you are unmistakably aware of them (like a really really close fly by). If this works, try step 2 again

Step 4: Really depends on where you are and/or who you are. If you are willfully violating air space and a civilian, you’ll probably get your certificate revoked and/or face. If you get near something really sensitive and probably are doing so purposefully despite attempts to get your attention, and you’re not over a densely populated area, you could get shot down.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 18 hours ago

With my limited experience, (Free flight and powered ultra-light), in most cases it's a genuine mistake, either because you're not familiar with where you are, badly estimated the drift due to the wind, mixed two landmarks, and ended-up in a restricted airspace (Even a simple free flight GPS would solve these issues) or, for commercial flight under ATC supervision you mixed up frequencies and didn't replied to the radio for a while.

An important thing is check whether the plane is OK not replying to ATC may-also mean that you have a fire on board and loss electrical system, or are already burning on the ground (I believe fighter jet were scrambled for the Air-Berlin suicide/mass murder but by the time they were on site, the plane was already on the ground) and most likely capture an image from the cockpit which may be used for further legal developments.

Then in principle, to get your pilots licence, even for an ultra-light you're expected to know that if a fighter jet rock their wings near you it means follow me_

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 day ago (3 children)

you’ll probably get your certificate revoked and/or face.

Lol, did you not finish typing it? 😆

"face prison time" I assume you meant?

[–] Shapillon 4 points 14 hours ago

They straight up remove the front part of your head.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 day ago

I think grammatically they meant you could also get your face revoked, leading into the following sentence of being shot down.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Apparently I edited without finishing lmao. I meant face criminal charges

[–] TastyWheat 2 points 17 hours ago

My brain confusedly decided to read it as "have your license and/or face revoked". Which I guess a fighter jet would likely be capable of!

[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Movies would have people believe that the jets are there to shoot down the errant jet. During the Cold War, this was entirely plausible and did happen. But more commonly, when a fighter jet is sent to intercept an unknown aircraft -- perhaps one that has entered restricted or prohibited airspace -- it may be just to have eyes on the situation.

Airspace is huge. The vastness of the air is like the vastness of the sea. Sometimes it's an advantage because there's fewer things to hit. But on the flip side, if an aircraft needs assistance, there might not be anyone for many miles in any direction. As for what an assisting fighter jet can do, the first is to establish navigational accuracy. History has shown that airplanes can get lost, and sometimes unfortunately end up hitting mountains or running into known obstacles or weather. A second aircraft can confirm the first aircraft's position, since two separate aircraft having navigational problems is exceptionally rare.

The next thing is having eyes on the outside of the aircraft. Things like a damaged engine on a jetliner aren't visible to the pilots, but there's a chance the passengers or cabin crew can look. But damage to a rudder is impossible to see from inside the aircraft; I'm not yet aware of a commercial aircraft equipped with a tail-viewing camera. Checking the condition of the landing gear is also valuable information, if a jetliner has taken damage but still aloft.

Finally, if it should come to it, an assisting aircraft can be the pilot's eyes, if for some reason the pilots can no longer see out their windscreen. At this point, the flight may already be close to the end but it may help avoid additional casualties on the ground. I'm reminded of the flight where volcanic ash sandblasted the windshield, or when a cargo jet had a fire onboard which filled the cockpit with thick smoke.

To be clear, neither incident was aided by fighter jets, but having an external set of eyes to give directions would have made things a little bit easier for the pilots. Other aircraft besides fighter jets can provide assistance, such as any helicopters or private pilots in the area. But of course, fighter jets are on-standby and can get to a scene very fast.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (2 children)

Shoot it down, or just get it's attention. A lot of the time there's a radio fuckup. If some guy cruising in his Cessna sees a fighter pull up along side, he's definitely switching to 121.5.

There was a commercial jet that was non responsive and the fighter could see the pilots passed out.

Otherwise be there to shoot it down quicker if it looks like it might be taking an aggressive action.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Point of fact: the stall speed of any fighter jet that isn't VTOL is way higher than the maximum speed of most private prop planes. They can do a fly-by, but they can't really pull along side them.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Some do, full flaps and uncomfortable high pitch (well, no flaps in that picture as it is a Mirage).

Of course there are probably certain types of jets that cannot fly below 150kt and it’s not like actual fighters capabilities are advertised on internet. I only know that Rafale is said to go "below 120kt" with 16 degrees pitch up in 15 tons configuration, FA-18 is something like 135kt at pitch 30 ! (I’d love to see a picture of that)

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 day ago (3 children)

Lpt, pretend to be asleep when trespassing on military aerospace. Lol

How did they wake the guy?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Its to scare civillians into compliance. Most of the time, they won't shoot you unless they believe your aircraft is about to strike a building or something like that.

Its also to allow the pilots of the fighter jet to visually see what's happening inside. In Helios Flight 522, the cabin presurization wasn't set properly, so the entire plane lost consciousless. The autopilot flew the flight and went into a holding pattern near the destination, and because the pilots haven't communicated with Air Traffic Control, send they fighter jets to "intercept" it. They didn't do anything besides the Fighter Jet pilot just visually looking in the plane, and see the oxygen masks deployed, and someone (later identified as a flight attendent) with a bottle of oxygen trying to get into the cockpit, but when he got in, the plane ran out of fuel so there was nothing he could do, and steered the plane away from the population center at the final moments.

All of that was witnessed by the Flighter Jets pilots and the testimony helped with the investigation.

Basically, the way I see it, they are there "just in case" something happens and they need to shoot it down.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

Its more what they can reasonably do. Keep in mind our commander in chief is ignoring both the congress and the courts right now and if a question like that was asked on lemmy five months ago most poeple would say thats impossible. Even then im 100% sure if they knew what was happening with the 9/11 planes they would have shot them down. I read the 911 report book. Its a hefty read. One of the last real books I read unfortunately. Im like 99% sure some of it talked about this kind of thing although its possible what im thinking of is from another source.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Depends. It's very situational, but the procedure first calls for monitoring and communications (long story short there are ways of communicating between aircraft using maneuvers.)

Beyond that, there will be attempt at guiding the offending aircraft, either to a runway, or to a safer area.

But if it comes to it, the passenger jet can be shot down - A Hijacked passenger liner should be considered a weapon of mass destruction.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

I like to think they put a big net around it and carry it home safely

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago

They bark as loudly as possible before shooting because once they shoot it turns into a situation™