So mamy cellular modems are going to break. That’s what you get for sticking to a shitty „standard” made by a corpo known from their shitty work.
this post was submitted on 02 Jan 2025
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Wait, isn't RNDIS what's used when you tether your Android's connection via USB? Or am I mistaking it for something else?
Yes, with the exception of some that switched to USB CDC NCM already. I seem to be lucky, the Pixel 6 is one of the first to have made the switch.
So if my mint install updates I won't be able to use USB tethering? Is there a way to update my phone to use USB CDC NCM? Or would I have better luck recompiling my mint install to add the standard they just removed? I'm pretty new to Linux (literally made the switch last November) and I sadly have to use USB tethering when my ISP shits the bed with routing to the US
Why couldn’t the NDIS driver run in userspace?
What's NDIS and what do you mean to run it in userspace? I am very new to Linux and am barely considered tech savvy so this is all going over my head
I just googled what a NDIS is and with my limited knowledge I think I understood what you're saying. Are you saying that I could keep an older/custom version of NDIS running on my own user account instead of changing the entire kernel for me to be able to use USB CDC NCM to keep using USB tethering?
Yes, and it's still in new phones. They're being disingenuous saying that it's android phones don't use it.
So I may not be able to use ADB and Fastboot anymore after I get the kernel update?
That's different protocols. This is only about the one being used when you share your phone's connection via USB (tethering). Neither adb nor fastboot make use of this.
Also, starting with Android 14, there should be an alternative available with NCM.
Well a14 is not that common but I've never heard of tethering before (except for WiFi tethering that improves connection) so I guess it's not important.
It's not about improving a connection, but making your phone's network connection available to other devices. USB tethering creates a network device at /dev/usb... that behaves like an any ordinary network device, allowing you to create a connection using it. Wi-Fi tethering creates a hotspot similar to what your router at home does.
So now you can't use USB hotspots on Linux? Yea mainstream has gone pretty evil then tbh. They didn't even stop at the previous drama.
There's no such thing as USB hotspots, that's a term for WiFi. Also you can still use the NMC protocol if your Android version is recent enough. Just not RNDIS anymore. It's an insecure Microsoft protocol, though this probably wouldn't have mattered for a lot of people.
There's no such thing as USB hotspots
That was its name on my old Sony phone though.
Also you can still use the NMC protocol if your Android version is recent enough.
Yea but it's not a justification.
It's an insecure Microsoft protocol, though this probably wouldn't have mattered for a lot of people.
That's why a DE warning would be enough. Linux is just making terrible decisions recently. I guess it'll continue until major maintainer changes take place and that won't happen without life losses because nobody is going to leave the project so we might lose many of the Linux's benefits in a few years imo.
A DE has little to do with this, it's a driver, it gets loaded when you plug in a compatible device, there's no interaction. This should have been disabled 2 years ago when the gaping security holes were found, and actually Greg had attempted to have it disabled in 2022 but it kept getting pushed back.
Uhm 2 years ago a14 was just released. There were pretty much no devices with it. Even though the protocol is unsafe, it's a good feature and killing desktop features just pushes Linux back.
Also a DE has stuff to do with it. It should be able to detect the connection and send a notification about it being potentially unsafe. Killing it is just a stupid move done by rich folks with latest flagships for rich folks with latest flagships.
You're couching it as Linux "killing desktop features", when really it's just Linux removing one ancient, insecure driver for which there is a modern, secure alternative. And it's not like Linux is wiping the driver off the face of the planet. If you want to reintroduce the ancient, insecure driver back into your system, there are extensive instructions on compiling your own kernel with whatever you want in it.
I would love to see a new Linux user who just installed Linux on a pretty old machine because of no official Windows 11 support or performance issues compiling their own kernel. And they're not guaranteed to have a new phone either.
It's like saying that we should remove SDR monitor support because HDR somewhat works on Linux and it's better so everyone should move to it.
Same goes to X11. It's still available on sane and serious distros because it's needed for some people.
Those are terrible comparisons. The amount of people using SDR and X11 still is gigantic, the amount of people using USB tethering is... not.
I think you missed the word "regularly" in your sentence. USB tethering is not required very often.
Nope, you just misread my comment
Well then I can only say I disagree. Tethering isn't as common as SDR but it's still a pretty sizeable thing imo.
Well, that'll be a problem for anything that's got crossplay between XP and Linux in a local environment.
Could probably be patched back in if you really need it or want it. Linux is open source after all.
someone using xp probably won't mind using some outdated linux kernel as well
Good on them, I guess.
This kind of thing can never be removed from Windows because somewhere there is a Fortune 500 company whose entire IT infrastructure is precariously balanced such that it relies on this obscure feature -- or some other equally rickety legacy Win32/16 API crap -- and if it ever goes away their business will collapse and they'll sue Microsoft for a billion dollars.
Those systems are running frozen versions of Windows, they're not being updated. Microsoft could introduce a patch for Windows 10 and 11 that removes the vulnerability and people running old software on XP would still be able to run it. Or, at the very least, make it disabled by default but let advanced users and sysadmins re-enable the vulnerable code.
That's what they did with SMB 1.0, for instance. It's disabled on any modern Windows install, even though a lot of universities and companies still have infrastructure based on it. If you browse the "advanced system features" options you can re-enable it manually, with the knowledge that you're voluntarily opening up your system to well known dangerous exploits in exchange for backwards compatibility.
EDIT: So further reading that's exactly what they're doing. The drivers aren't loaded by default on Windows 10 and 11, they need to be enabled after plugging a legacy device type requiring it.
What are you talking about? Microsoft constatntly removes and adds features to their software and OS, no one can sue them for it.
Yeah, windows 10/11 has broken a ton of stuff. I have to use RS232 plugs for programming controllers at work, and I had to buy new usb-RS232 cables for all our computers because windows 11 broke support for all the older cables. I've also had a lot of programs break.
It's really frustrating to be trying to troubleshoot if an old controller is working or not, and not know if you can't connect to it because it's fried or if some new windows update is preventing the connection/software from working.
Those cables more than likely were using clone chips and for whatever reason Microsoft decided to back completely banning them when identified.
You'll probably know if your old one is a fake chip because it'll say "not a prolific..." which isn't just a reboot and edit to allow unsigned drivers, it's dead.
What's worse, it's absolutely impossible to tell if the cable you bought has the fake chip since legitimate stores and legitimate cable makers bought them so the loser is people.
Works fine on Mac and Linux though. Naturally.
From what I've read, Microsoft just decided to drop support for the PL-2303HXA/ TA/TB/HXD/RA/SA/EA. Some people report that RA chipsets still work some of the time, but inconsistently.
You can also sometimes forcibly install old drivers, that will continue to work.
Ah sounds like two compounding issues then! I referenced this issue https://www.sleepyponylabs.com/blog/pl2303 since so many cables I had previously, even from the router and switch maker that came with the device, stopped working.
Great to know that there's a whole other bunch of issues around these cables further making life tough for consumers.
@cm0002 eh, does that mean I can't anymore tweak my Lumia? Fuck (yes I still have a Lumia, even many years after their death, it is still my best phone, android can't compete, an android, and I mean all of them, lags like hell on 2Gb RAM, the Lumia runs super smoothly with 1 Gb RAM)
android, and I mean all of them, lags like hell on 2Gb RAM
False. The key is the software you use. I use Lineage OS without Gapps, most apps from F-droid and my mid-range Samsung runs pretty smoothly with 2GB of RAM.
This. LineageOS on any device that supports it immediately improves said device x10.
I have an old as hell Galaxy tablet that had slowed down to a crawl after a few years. With LineageOS it's usable again.
@specterspectre @michael_palmer can you find an official custom ROM of LineageOS for Nokia X or Alcatel Pixi 4 (4")?
https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/ read on. Don't start any process on any device without reading all the info and steps.
@specterspectre @michael_palmer also Samsung Galaxy A70, however, it is critical that I don't leave it unusable since it's essential for my work
Unlikely, unless you tweak your Lumia that's plugged into a windows system remotely from a Linux system
Can't you not run your android on 2gb of ram? 🙃 That's such a weird complaint to be honest, how often did you tweak your lumia before, anyway?