this post was submitted on 22 Jul 2024

158 points (97.6% liked)

TechTakes

1401 readers

114 users here now

Big brain tech dude got yet another clueless take over at HackerNews etc? Here's the place to vent. Orange site, VC foolishness, all welcome.

This is not debate club. Unless it’s amusing debate.

For actually-good tech, you want our NotAwfulTech community

founded 1 year ago

MODERATORS

[email protected]

158

Generative AI is a climate disaster (techwontsave.us)

submitted 3 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

39 comments fedilink hide all child comments

The cost of simply retrieving an answer from the Web is infinitely smaller than the cost of generating a new one.

Great interview with Sasha Luccioni from Huggingface on all the ways that using generative AI for everything is both a) hugely costly compared to existing methods, and b) insane.

top 39 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old

[–] [email protected] 20 points 3 months ago (2 children)

But bill gates says not to worry about it, because ai will solve the climate disaster it's creating. -_-

[–] Crashumbc 9 points 3 months ago (1 children)

He was also claiming AI would destroy us a few years ago. (Not talking about climate, skynet style)

Side note: listening to him is as bad as listening to a celebrity.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 3 months ago

Maybe worse, since society considers him a SME on subjects he isn't, she they listen to his word as though it's coming from an actual SME.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 3 months ago

It's not creating a climate disaster, just amplifying the existing one.

[–] Raiderkev 8 points 3 months ago

All we gotta do is ask chatgpt how to fix it. Ezpz

[–] Etterra 7 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Tech could save us, but not AI. The tech that could isn't profitable enough to do so, though, so it's not happening. And it's not like oil corp. shareholders & execs are gonna accept a pay cut so that their subsidies could be redirected to more ecologically sustainable tech. Nope, we live in capitalist hell. At least, until we don't.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 3 months ago

I'm cheered that we now have so much wind and solar wanting to come online that it's straining grid interconnects so countries (US and NL for example) suddenly have to spend a bundle on infra so that the power can get across continents to where it's needed

this is a very cool problem to have: oh no! we have too much new clean energy!

it may not be sufficient, but it's an excellent start

[–] Mango 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Not putting awnings on the West windows of every window in America is a disaster!

[–] Eheran 2 points 3 months ago

This guy technology connects.

[–] 0laura -1 points 3 months ago

generating images using ai barely uses any energy.

[+] [email protected] -37 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Nope it isn't. You blame AI companies for pollution they didn't generate. Blame the energy sector.

Why the hell aren't we using mix of nuclear and renewables in this day and age is beyond me

[–] [email protected] 37 points 3 months ago (2 children)

holy shit your post history of full of takes this bad, that's an impressive track record of dim. must be exhausting

[–] [email protected] 29 points 3 months ago (2 children)

oh wow there’s some literal “it’s not a nazi unless it’s an old dead German” shit in there, they’re that kind of fash debatebro

[–] [email protected] 15 points 3 months ago

yeah, they don't teach much about fascist atrocities in ethiopia, and then people feel compelled to defend the good name of the boys in the black shirts because the poor dupes didn't build the concentration camps – just were allied to the builders.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 3 months ago

yeah sorry I kinda undersold it

thank fuck they came out swinging

[+] [email protected] -27 points 3 months ago (2 children)

And yet, my opponents in discussion failed to provide good counterarguments. You aren't going to convince me of anything by hating my post history

[–] [email protected] 32 points 3 months ago

And yet, my opponents in discussion

good gods you're going to be the most insufferable kind of person, aren't you

You aren't going to convince me of anything

this was a bit of a given

bet you also think the climate cost of cryptocurrency is also a failing of the energy sector to deliver clean power to the innocent sweet little industrial-scale mining tycoons, don't you

[–] [email protected] 24 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Nope it isn’t. You blame AI companies for pollution they didn’t generate. Blame the energy sector.

don't talk about providing good counterarguments, please

[–] [email protected] 13 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

see, because they can't provide their own, talking about good arguments is all they have left

[–] [email protected] 15 points 3 months ago

I one-up your well-sourced article with a "nope it isn't", your move.

[+] [email protected] -18 points 3 months ago (1 children)

What, you want to tell me I'm somehow obligated to exactly know where and how every service I use is produced?

Talk about a horrible take.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 3 months ago (2 children)

it's not “hating your post history”, it's just realisation that you're a shitty debatelord and talking to you is waste of time.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

it’s not “hating your post history”

it has been [0] days since I got accused of having emotions about a driveby poster

how rude

(e: not that you did it ofc, flere, but ykwim)

[+] [email protected] -16 points 3 months ago (3 children)

And yet you're talking to me... To prove some point perhaps? Feel free to ignore or block me if you don't like my posts.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 3 months ago

we can do better than block your shitty posts

[–] [email protected] 11 points 3 months ago (2 children)

nie, ja tylko ostrzegam, że wylecisz stąd na kopach, misiu kolorowy. lepiej ci będzie na wykopie.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 3 months ago (1 children)

i wanted to know how did you know, then i looked up his comment history on kbin and i wish i didn't (he extruded three more comments before he clocked that he's banned)

[–] [email protected] 12 points 3 months ago (2 children)

a hunch, really: i've met the type and had my suspicions, and then i've found that he posted the link about polish antitrust & consumer protection watchdog fining paypal, which is generally niche outside poland.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 3 months ago

i've seen that too but the final giveaway was this fucking thing:

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡° )つ──☆*:・

from the last comment on awful (after ban)

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 months ago (1 children)

btw i strongly suspect that there's a way to tell native language of poster by style of writing and specific kinds of grammar mistakes

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 months ago

it is an often-viable heuristic, yeah

[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 months ago (1 children)

misiu kolorowy

huh, first time I run across this (although admittedly my polish is dangerously-seat-of-pants)

[–] [email protected] 12 points 3 months ago (1 children)

long, boring explanation follows

spoiler

there's an informal mode of address that conveys the (one-sided, frequently) sense of familiarity, which goes [2nd person singular] [noun in vocative case] [adjective referring to the noun], like panie szanowny (lit. esteemed sir, but the inversion from the adj + noun to noun + adj signals different mode; so “szanowny panie” is formal, “panie szanowny” is shortening distance or expressing annoyance); it can be used, and frequently is, as a phrase that's a personal affectation (e.g. “królu złoty!”, literally “golden majesty”). the affectation is usually rather annoying.

on the other hand “misiu” (vocative case of diminutive word for “bear” or “bear cub” or “teddy bear”) is a common word of endearment.

so “misiu kolorowy” is a bit of a wordplay on both, and should generally convey serious lack of respect and clear annoyance. (i'm guilty of using this from time to time since the times of polish usenet.)

there's an added bonus in that there was a popular child series “miś colargol”, the pronunciation of “colargol” and “kolorowy” are pleasantly alliterative. (now this really shows my age….)

[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 months ago (1 children)

that's a much deeper (and thoroughly detailed) explanation than I expected, much thanks :)

[–] [email protected] 6 points 3 months ago (1 children)

It's when you want to say "kurwo jebana" but in a more polite, sophisticated way.

Think "bless your heart".

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 months ago

yeah I got that from the explanation flere gave :)

Think “bless your heart”.

most polish (as in character/style) translation I've seen today

[–] [email protected] 7 points 3 months ago

I'M A BAT

I'M GAY

[–] lmaydev 16 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Since we aren't using those it is in fact a climate disaster currently and they know that.

Assuming you want to ground your argument in our reality.

[–] [email protected] -4 points 3 months ago

Some energy sources are and some arent polluting. Do you suggest I should audit every single one of these companies on how they power stuff?

I don't even know if development of AI is productive or not, maybe it just consumes electricity, or maybe in the future AI will build energy sources that will sustain humanity for ever.