this post was submitted on 19 Jan 2024
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Linux

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Linux is a family of open source Unix-like operating systems based on the Linux kernel, an operating system kernel first released on September 17, 1991 by Linus Torvalds. Linux is typically packaged in a Linux distribution (or distro for short).

Distributions include the Linux kernel and supporting system software and libraries, many of which are provided by the GNU Project. Many Linux distributions use the word "Linux" in their name, but the Free Software Foundation uses the name GNU/Linux to emphasize the importance of GNU software, causing some controversy.

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I’ve been distrohopping for a while now, and eventually I landed on Arch. Part of the reason I have stuck with it is I think I had a balanced introduction, since I was exposed to both praise and criticism. We often discuss our favorite distros, but I think it’s equally important to talk about the ones that didn’t quite hit the mark for us because it can be very helpful.

So, I’d like to ask: What is your least favorite Linux distribution and why? Please remember, this is not about bashing or belittling any specific distribution. The aim is to have a constructive discussion where we can learn about each other’s experiences.

My personal least favorite is probably Manjaro.

Consider:

  • What specific features/lack thereof made it less appealing?
  • Did you face any specific challenges?
  • How was your experience with the community?
  • If given a chance, what improvements would you suggest?
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[–] [email protected] 65 points 11 months ago (4 children)

Ubuntu. They've managed the worst of both worlds: like Debian, everything is old (though admittedly not as old), but unlike Debian, everything is broken/buggy/flakey. It's the old-and-busted distro that I'm routinely told is "the only Linux we support".

[–] [email protected] 18 points 11 months ago (4 children)

If Debian is not great as a desktop distro, it’s at the very least remarkably stable as a server distro. The sentiment extends somewhat to Ubuntu LTS. It could be better, but in terms of uptime and just working I can’t fault either distro.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

I don't have many issues on Ubuntu like you imply. It's the reason why I stick with it despite snaps.

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[–] [email protected] 43 points 11 months ago

Ubuntu / snaps

[–] rtxn 40 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (3 children)

I'm about to piss off a lot of people.

It's Arch and Arch-derivatives. And I'm saying it as an Arch user, btw, and I actually love it.

Between the Big Three (Fedora, Debian, Arch), it is the least likely to have an official package for somewhat niche applications. If something is not available as a flatpak or appimage, I have to compile it from source or an AUR PKGBUILD, but we all know the dangers of doing that. Some software will just assume that it's running on a particular disribution, usually Ubuntu. Some software will detect the distribution and straight-up refuse to work on Arch.

That being said, it would take a lot to make me switch to a stable point-release distribution. Arch's advantages more than make up for the sub-par software support.

(actually, I lied. Fuck Canonical and *Ubuntu. And IBM.)

[–] [email protected] 9 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

Some software will just assume that it's running on a particular disribution, usually Ubuntu. Some software will detect the distribution and straight-up refuse to work on Arch.

Name to blame, please.

[–] rtxn 7 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Twingate Connector. The installer script only works if the OS uses either the APT or the DNF package manager, otherwise it exits. Fortunately it has many deployment methods, including Docker. I ended up using the systemd unit in a Debian container inside Proxmox.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Just use Distrobox my friend.

I use it on Fedora Atomic (Silverblue) and I install Arch- and AUR-software all the time.
In that way I can access everything I want and still enjoy the comfort of my unbreakable base.
Another plus is that if I should break my Arch container, I can just remove and reinstall it without affecting my host. The performance is about the same as with Flatpaks, so, negabile.

If you like Arch, then just use Ubuntu/ Debian/ Fedora/ whatever as container image and never stress yourself anymore with PKGBUILD

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[–] TCB13 32 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

Ubuntu because they've the ability to great things and end up just delivering a buggy and mangled version of Debian with proprietary crap, spyware, snaps wtv. After all we're talking about the distro that had ISOs on their download page with a broken installer multiple times.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

I don't hate them, but this hits hard. They are THE most influential distro for people outside of the community. They have by far the biggest user base and community, but instead of using this to collaborate with other distributions and specially with the freedesktop folks for the improvement of the commons, they have this culture of downstream work that rarely get the effort needed to be upstreamed. It's usually "it's good enough for us, so that's where we'll leave it", and they end up with these weird solutions that only they use.

[–] TCB13 9 points 11 months ago

It’s usually “it’s good enough for us, so that’s where we’ll leave it”, and they end up with these weird solutions that only they use.

Exactly. And to make things even worse then you've people upstream (Debian) or sidestream (other distros) that eventually decide to implement whatever they did but properly and then they go there, pick it and replace their original implementation.

[–] jerrythegenius 27 points 11 months ago

My least favourites are probably ubuntu and manjaro, not so much because of the distros themselves but the organizations behind them being a bit dodge.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Manjaro. Its just Arch but worse

[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Yeah I was gonna say Manjaro too. I used it for a while while I was heading towards Arch but wasn't feeling fully confident to go full Arch as a daily driver yet, and it was nothing but trouble for me. I found that it tried to prevent me from breaking things, which is not necessarily bad, but it would also break things by itself and then this feature would prevent me from going in and fixing them.

I much prefer it when the OS just gets out of my way and lets me do what I want, even if it's dumb lol

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[–] [email protected] 24 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Anything Red Hat. Screw GPL corporatism.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Had to scroll way too far for this.

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I know it's probably an odd choice, but ChromeOS. It has the potential to be not just a good starting point for new Linux users but also a distro that could allow Linux to be a lot more accessible to people who aren't as technologically capable. The main problem is that, similar to android, Google prevents ChromeOS from being used as a proper Linux distro. Right now, it might be a good alternative to Windows and MacOS but as a Linux distro, it's just not worth using. Especially considering that Linux already has some options available for running android apps, such as Waydroid, that work pretty well.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 11 months ago (2 children)

I really think Google has no idea what it wants ChromeOS to be anymore, they're just kinda shoving in shoddy solutions to its problems so they can say "hey we can do that too!"

soon they're gonna introduce Steam and I look forward to that being a big shitshow lol

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago

Have they ever? ChromeOS's original "app store" was just Chrome's extension store. It's been awhile since I've checked but Google doesn't (or at least didn't) officially support running android apps in ChromeOS Flex. Instead of focusing on getting more apps running on ChromeOS, they're actively working on Google Play Games for Windows (which also hurts android). For which I think I saw that there are games that work in Google Play Games but they don't work in ChromeOS for some reason. I'd imagine that there are a lot of other weird things but it's been a while since I've actually used it.

It's just one of those things where, ChromeOS has the potential to be a good competitor to Windows and MacOS (and maybe even a good Linux distro) but for some reason Google does nothing with it to make it worth using and actually seems to be actively harming it.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago

It's Pichai's handiwork from what I understand. He was in charge of it before becoming CEO according to Wikipedia.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 11 months ago (1 children)

NIXOS. It has a very steep learning curve without acceptable documentation and once I climbed the learning curve, I realized that it was very different from the Linux that I love.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 11 months ago (5 children)

I'm going to mention two:

Manjaro. I've attempted to use Manjaro a few different times, and outside of a VM it just didn't work properly; on my laptop it would boot loop for reasons I don't understand, it had poor hardware support and optimization on a Raspberry Pi, and it didn't last long on my desktop. It's had its chances, I'm done trying.

I really did not hitch horses with Pop!_OS, and it's almost entirely because Pop!_OS started at Gnome and kept fucking going. Just thinking about the two miserable weeks I spent trying to get Gnome to do anything is making me physically angry. Words like disobedient and belligerent come to mind when I think of what it's like to use Pop!_OS. Linux Mint is designed to feel familiar to anyone coming from Windows. Pop!_OS feels like it's designed to be the opposite of that, it deliberately doesn't work the way you think it does. YOU have to conform to IT. And I FUCKING hate it. It is never welcome on my hardware ever again.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

Ubuntu: For shilling all kinds of profrietary garbage by default. If I wanted that I'd be on Windows.

Also the changes they make to GNOME make it worse, they take away what makes it good, the flow.

[–] genie 5 points 11 months ago

Exactly what I came here to say.

Prompt me for Ubuntu Pro once (in the GUI on first login)? Shame on you, but I'll move past it.

Put an ad in the terminal every time I update my system though? Straight to jail.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Ubuntu: It's not a lack of features that pushed me away; it's more about the way things are going. I am not a fan of snap packages. I have run into odd issues trying to use them. I used Ubuntu server for my Dell Poweredge and I shut it down until I can find a suitable replacement. I struggled with it respecting my DNS settings which in turn killed my reverse proxy setup.

Manjaro: While I love Arch and some of its derivatives, I can't stand by Manjaro. I thought it would have been a good OS to use since I was familiar with Arch, but it had enough dependency issues where updates broke them. Funny enough, never have I had a dependency issue with just plain old Arch.


I use Arch btw. But besides the meme on it, I legitimately eo use arch and couldn't be happier.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Same. Both started out good but kept becoming more and more... not good. If nothing else Manjaro taught me how to chroot from a live distro to fix catastrophic failures. Ubuntu really ruined my week when they decided to try becoming a smart phone with the very touch centric looking UI at the time when I didn't have time to revert or change distros, which is what finally pushed me to run servers headless and use ssh. Last I tried none of the phone like de's are particularly intuitive as touch interfaces either.

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 11 months ago (2 children)

For me personally: Something like Arch. I want to spend as little time as possible on installation and configuration, and I don't want to have to read update notes or break my system. But I get that it's great for some people, and their wiki is just next level!

In general: Ubuntu. It feels like I read something about Canonical causing trouble every other week, and don't even get me started on snaps!

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (5 children)

Unpopular opinion :

  • Arch, i installed it long ago so i can't remember anything except that i spent lot hours for its installation.
  • Reason : spend a lot time reading the wiki without an easy installer...even Ubuntu was better but i wanted a challenge and a better uderstanding on linux.
  • Some AUR package didn't work.
  • Why Arch ? To get the lastest os and package as i had a recent gaming laptop.

So I changed and prefered manjaro with its ui for linux os, graphic card...but some thing were broken...than i settled Pop-Os for 3 years and distrohopped again for immutable os : Vanilla OS and Fedora Kinoite. :)

Another distro :

  • Ubuntu
  • reason : snap and various decisions.
[–] Falcon 7 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I enjoyed arch for how straight forward the install was.

Gentoo however, every time I do that from scratch it’s with X, Westland is NetworkManager that give up (my recommendation is oddlamma installer)

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 11 months ago

Not a whole lot of experience distro-hopping here (went from Ubuntu to Endeavour and haven't really changed since) but from what I know it seems like most distros have their place. Arch is highly customisable and all rolling release distros are good for gamers and those who need the latest software. Debian, Ubuntu, Mint, and other LTS distros are good for servers and newcomers (fewer big updates and therefore fewer potential crises)

For the sake of answering the question, I'd say Ubuntu is my least favourite. Its pretty bloated, and then there's the whole snap fiasco

[–] [email protected] 14 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Someone already said Manjaro, so my second pick would be ElementaryOS. In the past they've had this weird attitude about open source things being free (I get supporting devs for projects you like of course, but I don't agree that it's "cheating" to not pay for every single piece of open source software you use), and they seem to get a lot of hype and praise for what's essentially just Ubuntu painted up to look like MacOS IMO.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

I use Fedora as my primary desktop distro. It's a sturdy base with relatively up-to-date packages from the repos. It doesn't really push technology I consider undesirable, like Snaps. Even though I have to rely on RPMFusion for a number of proprietary parts, due to Fedora's free software stance, I don't have any particular qualms about that. I also increasingly use Flatpaks anyway.

When I used to use Reddit the /r/fedora community was helpful and welcoming.

One downside is because the kernel changes frequently, and I (sadly) own a Nvidia GPU, akmods runs very often. Another downside is sometimes that frequently changing kernel can cause issues. I think in the past year or two I've had two distinct occasions where a kernel upgrade caused my mounted shares to not mount correctly. Reporting an issue to upstream also takes quite some involvement, as I discovered when I had to create some Red Hat account to report an issue about the packaging of some software in a beta release of Fedora.

So all-in-all I would say Fedora is a strong distro. It is probably not the most beginner-friendly one, though, given how you have to dip your toes into RPMFusion and related challenges. It used to be worse, since DejaVu used to be the default font system-wide and you had to install a fonts package from COPR to make the system actually look pleasant. Since then they switched to Noto, which makes the font situation MUCH better.

On servers and VMs I use Debian because I do not have the patience to maintain a faster moving Fedora multiple times over. This is exacerbated by the awful defaults of Gnome, which I have to bend into shape with extensions. When Fedora 40 releases later this year I fully intend to reinstall from scratch since KDE Plasma 6 will be available.

edit: i misread the prompt and just talked about my favorite distro that i actively use. whoops.

My least favorite distro could be Manjaro if I actually used it, but it is Ubuntu because of how close it is to being a great distro. Snaps really soured me to that deal. Snapd and Snaps make it difficult to use in VMs, too, because now you have to over-commit resources for something that could and should be smaller and simpler. Debian stays winning, as usual.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Ubuntu when it introduced snaps, anything red hat, anything immutable

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[–] smackjack 12 points 11 months ago

I don't think I've ever used Ubuntu for more than a month. I just don't like the way it looks, how locked down everything is, and how hard it is to customize.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 11 months ago

I never figured out why, but I couldn't get any version of suse to work properly on my computers. I've been with Debian (sid) for about a decade now, so not the most up to date criticism here.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

RHEL and other extremly long term support distros that have a significant user base because they hold back a lot of software features, network protocol features and moves to new dependencies that are required to work on the oldest and the newest supported distro for any given upstream software project.

Also, any time I have to learn something about a quirk in a version of software in use there it is basically wasted life time because the knowledge is already outdated by the time I obtain it.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

I really hate to say this, but Lubuntu.

I enjoyed it for a solid few months (it's a lightweight ~~XFCE~~ LXQt version of Ubuntu, so it worked great on my very underpowered MacBook Pro from ages ago) so it was heartbreaking when one day, randomly, I couldn't get past the login screen and my TimeShift backups didn't work.

If it wasn't for this out-of-nowhere critical failure, I would say I loved it.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago

I'd agree with Manjaro, It was my first I kinda know Linux distro after brown Ubuntu and Mint at the time it really worked well, but then package desyncing started affecting my installation followed by the first of many controversial behaviours from the team. It's one of many Linux distros that hasn't progressed much in the last few years, like elementary, and the idea it is easy to arch is false when you end up having to babysit updates because testing isn't as up to par as something like Fedora or Mint.

Garuda is a distro that has swung from a do not install to prob the best "Welcome to arch" distro for me. Their focus on tooling is getting up there with Mint & Suse BTRFS manager being a shining program of the project. More so, shows how utterly pointless Manjaro has become and badly managed the project is.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Any DE that looks remotely like Windows. My journey to Linux began with a seething hatred of the way Microsoft does pretty much anything. Including the Win10 UI. So when I jumped ship I wanted something completely different. I tried Gnome on a couple distros but ultimately landed on Pop!_OS and really like it!

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[–] pathief 6 points 11 months ago (1 children)

After spending a ton of time migrating CentOS machines I have to say anything red hat related.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 11 months ago (2 children)

I don't like Ubuntu because of their forcing method to use Snap package manager.

I don't like Manjaro because of its poor dependency management. Many dependencies are not declared, so that if you update a package, it won't update the undeclared dependency and it won't work any longer. You have to update everything or nothing, and when disk space becomes low, updating everything at once is impossible.

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[–] zloubida 6 points 11 months ago (2 children)

I don't get the hate for Manjaro, TBH. I never had any problem with it, and I used it as my main OS for a few years now.

[–] TheGrandNagus 7 points 11 months ago (1 children)

People dislike it because:

  • There's no real reason to use it over Arch/EndeavourOS

  • Their holding back of updates for 2 weeks is stupid and can cause breakage/dependency issues when you also have stuff installed via AUR (which doesn't get held back for 2 weeks)

  • They hold back packages for 2 weeks, citing stability and that they can check for issues then patch before they push, but then they just... don't do that. Known issues still get pushed.

  • Manjaro repos have had issues with malware in the past

  • Manjaro has on multiple occasions had their SSL certificates expire, with their advertised "fix" being to roll your system time back. This is a job that can be automated, or at the very least should have a reminder for someone in Manjaro to sort out. The fact it happened once is an embarrassment, but the fact it's happened more times is absolutely inexcusable.

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago (3 children)

I swear it is my machine or something, but despite CachyOS claiming being faster and more optimized I have yet to benchmark it as faster than the stock kernel for things I play around with. I wrote an application in rust to process a large text file and it both compiled and ran slower on CachyOS. I play around with llama.cpp and again it compiles and runs slower on CachyOS. I want to like Cachy, but right now all I can see is a bunch of window dressing to stock Arch with KDE and a couple of themes that I would rather change to default.

Also, why in the hell am I being asked to make a wifi password encryption key with the damn USB installer? CachyOS is not the only one. A lot of KDE using distros pop up the encryption window when you setup WiFi on the install image. Why? You want me to temporarily encrypt my wifi password on a temporary live image??? I just slows me down.

Anyways, I'm sure I'm crazy and clearly it is fast for somebody, but I can't even get games to benchmark higher.

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago

I'm going to say Gentoo Linux. It's a good learning tool and I suppose maybe a tiny bit faster if you actually custom-compile everything for your hardware from source, but that's a crazy waste of time.

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