617
this post was submitted on 04 Mar 2024
617 points (96.3% liked)
politics
19092 readers
4800 users here now
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.
Example:
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
We can call Trump nutty all day, but good doctors won't make a diagnosis without seeing the patient. All this does is serve to make the doctor look bad, even if we all suspect his brain looks like Swiss cheese.
He didn't diagnose him, he said his behavior is consistent with a diagnosis of dementia. Stating your informed opinion =/= diagnosing. His rapid decline is obviously some sort of degenerative cognitive illness (aka dementia). Anyone with relevant training/experience can see it at this point
Yeah but you could probably find a psychologist to say that about most people.
I mean I hate trump and I hope he does have dementia but one psychologist's opinion isn't particularly reassuring. Trump has always rambled a lot. If he were forgetting where he is while on camera or whatever that would be a big deal, but we're not there yet obviously.
He's been, literally, this is not an exaggeration, forgetting who his opponents are. Regularly. He thinks he's running against Obama. He's brought that up like four times now.
There's a difference between forgetting who you're opponent is, and saying Obama instead of Biden.
Um certain that Trump is very far from our best and brightest, I'm just saying I doubt he's about to forget his own name.
A ton of psychology is done through telehealth now. If you are spewing madness on TV, radio, and social media all damn day it's a pretty decent sample set for analysis.
Yeah but still... a diagnosis is usually made after an interview and tests where appropriate.
That's why they're using a phrase like "is consistent with dementia" rather than "is dementia"
Yeah, that little bit of phrasing is doing a lot of work.
That said, as a layman, at what point is the vast corpus of data that is his assorted interviews, statements, appearances, etc on TV enough to call it? I'm curious how much more a one-on-one with a therapist could reveal. Obviously, there's a persona that is prominent any time a camera is on, but if the camera is on all the time, when is it just his base personality?
I don't think really any amount of this particular form of data is enough to be confident in an opinion.
As an analogy, I might be obese and have chest pain, but without scans and tests no doctor is going to say I have ischaemic cardiovascular disease.
Does a 77yo who mixes up names have dementia? Is it just diminished cognitive abilities due to age, combined with stress? Does it really matter?
IMO, any self-respecting psychologist would avoid paying an opinion without having a chance to interview a co-operative patient.
That makes sense, and I feel like that's a good rule for 99.99% of people. Trump introduces one unusual facet and one that I don't know enough about:
He's on camera all the time. His media presence is more than that of most of humanity, including those that do it professionally. Both being filmed and participating. Sure, a doctor needs scans to do things, but what is the test for this kind of thing and can the answers be derived from his very prominent existence?
How does a therapist handle a non-cooperative patient? Let's say the court order's therapy. What does the poor bastard who works with him have to do to accomplish their task?
In practice, there's not a huge emphasis on diagnosis.
As in, if grandma is buying a 12 pack of toilet paper every week when she does her shopping, it doesn't really matter whether you classify it as dementia or forgetfulness, you just need to figure out the best way to minimise the harm and give her the best quality of life moving forward.
Most mental health diagnoses are the same. Even if you get a clinical diagnosis of "bi-polar" the treatment options are similar to most other mental health problems and you just work through them until you find a good one.
Similarly courts don't care about diagnosis. They might get a psychiatrist to assess whether someone is fit to stand trial, but that's a measurement of cognitive function rather than diagnosing the reason for cognitive impairment.
It's ok we already went down this road the first time around with yet another doctor that said essentially the same thing except it wasn't dementia it was narcissistic personality disorder.
As you probably know from history, we elected him anyway. This doctors statement will quickly be ignored as well after some hand wringing about how wrong it is for them to have said anything and we'll elect him again because propaganda is a hell of a drug...