this post was submitted on 17 Sep 2023

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Mycelium has a grain preference, it seems. (Brown rice, Popcorn mix) (lemmy.ca)

submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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I had a bit of grain left during my last run, so I mixed the bits I had left.

This is interesting, actually. Over the next few months, I'll continue this experiment to see what grain mixes might work better for spawn.

While this wasn't a "proper" test, I had still hypothesized that the higher starch content in the popcorn would do better. I guess not.

I'll try and separate testing into different categories like starch content, moisture content, mycelium strain, etc. There is probably a ton more conditions to isolate as well.

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[–] Sludgehammer 13 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Not really into mushroom growing, but my guess is that since popcorn has a thick hull (which is why it pops when heated) it offers more of a barrier to the growing mycelium. I bet if the corn were cracked or flaked beforehand the fungus would be much more inclined to grow on the popcorn.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

You are very much correct. The mycelium loves cracked kernels as it has easy access to the starch. Since the kernels are hydrated, the shells aren't as much of a barrier in a 100% popcorn jar.

What I find curious is that the mycelium is actively avoiding kernels in a more preferential manner. Since the nutrition value is lower, a slower propagation on the kernels is expected. However, it's just nope'ing around the popcorn until it absolutely has no other place to jump to. It's cool to see that the preference is so distinct.

This begs another question though, and someone else pointed it out: How long do you need to store the spawn for? Slowing down mycelium growth could have its benefits.

Edit: Derp. I completely forgot why the shells can be preferred. If you have to shake or stir your spawn jar to distribute the mycelium, the shells keep the kernels from sticking together as hard.

[–] Mojojojo1993 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Interesting. What spawn was it ?

I have quite a bit of popcorn kicking about. Did you pressure cook it first ?

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Mixed cubensis genetics.

Popcorn is great when used alone without rice. I pre-cook it to ~60-80% hydration'ish, or when I can bite into it easily and the center has just started getting hydrated and isn't crunchy. I'll fill my spawn jars and load it in my pressure canner for about 90mins or so, depending on how many jars I have.

There are methods on YouTube for no pressure canner popcorn, so you can get away with a quick pasteurize it seems. Popcorn is obviously food-grade, so it's going to be fairly clean out of the bag.

So far, popcorn is also working awesome for pink and golden oyster spawn. Once Shiitake and Lions Mane get started, which takes a bit anyway, they do fairly well. I do want to experiment with adding peptone to the water when I pre-cook it to see if I can give it a little more "kick".

Price is variable and is only really cost effective with +50lb bags, if that is a concern. That is just about pinching pennies.

[–] Mojojojo1993 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

That's class. So I'll need to boil them to give plenty hydration. I'll need to give this a shot. I'm looking at oysters if I can get an easy enough substrate

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

The goal is to hydrate them "just enough" but not so much that the kernels split. Honestly, about 20% of the kernels split in my last run and the mycelium loves the easy access to the starches.

I am doing a masters mix (50/50 hardwood saw dust, soy hulls) as well as some straight-up Aspen shavings as a test. Animal bedding is dirt cheap, so if my yield is similar to the masters mix, I'll save some more cash that way.

Also, I'll keep this community updated then. I have already purchased several types of substrates and additives to experiment with. Learning how to chase total yields when I was growing cannabis was fun, and it seems easy enough to continue doing that.

Next stop for the near future is spore collecting and strain isolation. I really want to start a business from this and develop some productive strains.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

My understanding is that you want to boil them until they're soft enough that you can easily split the kernels with your nail. For the batch I made, that was about 20-25 minutes at a hard boil. Compared to the batch of rye berries I made the same day (boiled for half that time), I think it took about a week longer for the mycelium to really get going in the popcorn, but otherwise all jars are doing equally well.

One big difference, however, is for long-term storage. I prepped my jars about three months ago, and still have some sitting in the closet. The jar with rye berries now has about 3/8" of water standing in the bottom (and this only started happening about a month and a half ago), while the popcorn jars do not have any standing water and the mycelium still looks more like cotton candy.

So my take-away is that if you're in a hurry to expand your mycelium, rye berries will get you to the fruiting stage faster. If you plan to let your jars sit for awhile, popcorn is definitely the better option.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Ah yes. You bring up good points.

I just remembered that ease of a "break-and-shake" is a thing as well. Popcorn simply doesn't stick together as bad.

It's also the reason that I rinse the hell out of my brown rice. It'll keep the free starches from acting like glue.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Hmm I haven't tried rice, didn't even realize that was a thing, but yeah I can see the starch being a problem. Maybe over the Winter I'll have time to work more with mine, I've been crazy busy the past week getting a new server in place but it's finally up and running now.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Brown rice colonizes really fast but it's only really good if you plan to use it as soon as it's ready. Otherwise, it'll break down fairly quick and is a pain to spawn to bulk after it does.

I got hooked on this hobby after innoculating some Uncle Bens 90 Second rice bags and learning how easy it can be.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

With the popcorn, I split one jar between two bags of straw and it worked well (but of course took some time to fill in). Since the rye berry jar has so much liquid on it, I might just dump the whole thing into a single bag when I'm ready to spawn the next one.

The next thing I need to figure out is spawning a colony from the existing mushrooms so I know how to keep the cycle going. And that'll require having some new grain jars prepped and ready to go. Maybe in a few weeks...

[–] Mojojojo1993 2 points 1 year ago

That's excellent. I'd just like to grow oysters so I don't need to spend money on things I can grow. But it's a weigh up of buying substrate vs just buying mushrooms.

Just playing around with things. Have tried some wood shavings and some wood from the wood shed. So similar kinda thing as you. You are just more robust. I kinda just chuck stuff at it and see if anything sticks.

My issue would be if my spouse are good enough in the first place

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Interesting. If you'll be trying a bunch of stuff, have you thought about hominy?

The shell of the popcorn might be an issue, and hominy has no shell.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

I haven't tried with hominy, but I do have 10lbs of millet in spawn now.

Just speculation, but hominy may need to be pH adjusted and might be prone to getting too sticky and breaking down a little too fast. This might be an issue if you are spawning a bunch and need to shake the grains for even propagation.

Other than that, I just read on another forum that it spawns very quick.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

What species is this? Can you get the popcorn kernel soft enough?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Mixed genetics cubensis. (It's of PE/JMF lineage; I don't want to get distracted in those details since it's not quite appropriate for this community.)

I wrote up more details in another comment, but yep, you just pre-boil the popcorn before sterilization. It's not cost effective in low quantities, btw.

[–] Agent641 5 points 1 year ago

I would rate this thread a B+

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

I use rye berries and oat mainly, deer corn would probably be cheaper though...

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I haven't tested/verified this myself but I've heard that mycelium grows particularly well on millet and rye berries. Might be a couple to add into your experimenting.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

Rye is the go-to and millet has a massive amount of surface area. I know rye will work but since it is a very well established grain to use, I want to explore other options as well. TBH, brown rice has been performing very well for me in all cases as well.

I have 10lbs of millet (split into 4 bags) that is getting close to 20 days or so. It started extremely slow, but once it took hold, the colonization has increased speed exponentially. I also have to break it apart more often to get more colonies established.

[–] BMatthew 1 points 1 year ago

Just ran six jars of popcorn through my instapot yesterday and will be inoculating today with my first run of popcorn. Ordered rye but it is weeks out and didn’t want to wait so go some popcorn from the bulk section of my grocery store. Interesting to see the mix. By left over, did you do a grain to grain transfer or just mix the two as you didn’t have enough at home to fill all the jars you had?