this post was submitted on 30 Jan 2025
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Wow. Maybe the left/right wing dichotomy is a massive oversimplification compared to the much more nuanced reality. What a surprise.
It's not even a simplification. It's a bold-faced lie that pretends a lot of different opinions are the same.
This is some shit a 14 year old would think is deep lmao
Life is far more complex than a simple good/bad dichotomy. If one is bad and another is much worse; they are absolutely not the same and you actually help the worse one by essentially sane washing the depraved lengths they willingly and want to reach.
With L/R, one has greedy and corrupt outliers and compromised leadership while the other is a majority of grifting hateful racists and sexual abusers who are also greedy as fuck.
You do bad people a service when you smooth out the good/bad gradient into a solely boolean concept. All nuance is lost, and that only helps those in bad faith.
Life is more than black and white, that’s why when you’re presented with a black or white option and they both suck you find a different option, you don’t defend the less sucky one.
And left wing authoritarianism is what you saw in the USSR or China today. It is not simply corruption and greed, it is genocide and suppression of civilians.
Lol "the genocides my guy committed were just outliers"
Yeah as in a few oieces of shit vs the entire wing being made up of pieces of shit. Just look at the list of sitting right wing politicians and how many of them have been convicted of sexual abuse of some kind. You won’t find a list even a quarter of the size from the left.
So yeah, you can fuck off with your brain dead both sides bullshit, moron.
Do you think this is talking about the dems and the repubs?
When people thought the Earth was flat, they were wrong. When people thought the Earth was spherical, they were wrong. But if you think that thinking the Earth is spherical is just as wrong as thinking the Earth is flat, then your view is wronger than both of them put together.
The authoritarian left is bad
The authoritarian right is bad
But if you think that the two are equally bad, then you're wronger than wrong
And if you think that makes either defendable you’ve lost the plot.
Good thing I didn't say that.
Too bad you missed when I called both "bad"
Two things can both be indefensible, and yet still one is preferable. Although you lead with "and", you seem to be suggesting that this isn't the case, which is a wild position that doesn't hold up to even that barest of scrutiny.
Both are bad, neither is preferable. The world is not binary, you have other options.
Guess what?
You can rank a list of things by preference, even if it contains more than 2 items and multiple items are bad.
Let me give you an example:
- Give an innocent child a candy
- Run over an innocent child's foot
- Blow up an innocent child with C4
2 of those options are bad and indefensible, but between the bad options, one is certainly worse.
Come back to me when you have an argument that stands up to a light breeze, your "all bad things are equally bad" routine is the kind of nonsense that allows monsters to come into power.
Right so you go with 1.
You don’t go with left fash/2 or right fash/3, those are out of the question.
That's such a cool story.
Too bad this isn't a discussion about that option. We're discussing the difference between option 2 and option 3, or the lack thereof. You can talk about things you don't want to choose.
Dude, wtf man. This isn't complicated, I don't know why you're having such a hard time of it.
And we’re discussing how some “options” are not options at all, they fall under the bad label and the degree of difference is irrelevant.
Maybe "options" was a bad choice of word.
These are things we're talking about and just because we're talking about a thing doesn't mean we are bound to choose it if given them as a choice.
I can say that I hate one thing more than another thing without ever being forced to choose either of them.
Just like in my example I'm not forced to run over a child's foot just because I spoke about it.
And besides sometimes you ARE forced to choose between a list of bad options. Especially in politics. There is certainly a "least bad" option, and treating everything bad as equal is, like I said before, how monsters get power.
I refuse to believe that these are the responses of someone having a good faith discussion. You're clearly trolling, but idky because you're not being funny or clever. You're just making tangential nonsense arguments for no discernable reason.
Mao, Stalin, AND Hitler ALL genocided within their own territory, whether intentionally or not ( Mao wiped-out knowledge-workers, creating massive famine, ttbomk )
The whole "horseshoe political-spectrum" is failing-to-understand that there actually is a different dimenion involved..
Considered-reasoning only lives in the middle,
& imprint->reaction-mind owns both extremes, AND it also owns many who nominally are "center".
Kahneman's "Thinking Fast and Slow" is on the difference between the 2 kinds of mental-function,
and to the best of my knowledge, the imprint->reaction mind is lower-forebrain, while the considered-reasoning mind is upper-forebrain.
ALL ideology/prejudice/"religion" ( religion, not spirituality, which is considered-reasoning rooted ) is rooted in the imprint->reaction bypassing-actual-thinking mind.
The Catholic inquisition, the murderers of any religion, the murderers of any political-ideology, etc..
I simply cannot understand how anybody could maintain that the ideology-genociding-of-the-left OR the ideology-genociding-of-the-right OR the ideology-genociding-of-religions OR the ideology-genociding-of-racism OR the ideology-genociding-of-gender-racism ( the inquisition was part of that, the Muslim immigrant gang-rapes committed in their new countries is part of that, the male-supremacist-vote which helped block Harris from winning in the US is part of it, the fact that rape is a pretend-crime in actual-practice is part of that, as the male authorities just don't consider it to be a "real" crime, if its "only" against girls & women, the scum who rewrote Genesis millenia ago, to alter it from saying that women "ate of the fruit of the knowledge of Good & Evil" ( which it still says ), to instead "interpreted" that, right in the text, so that instead of meaning that women ate of moral understanding ( altruism is demonstrated to be generalized-mothering, in wasps & humans, & grandmothers in the tribe are a significant tribal-survival-advantage, through deep-time/evolution )..
Is the intentional-genociding of Tibetans & Uighurs "OK" because it is being done by the left?
Was Stalin's force-exterminating millions of his own country's people somehow OK?
XOR is it that the genociding of fascists doesn't count?
Obviously, you hold that I, like the original-poster am beyond-reason, beyond wrong.
That's fine.
I'm fed-up with being gaslit by ideologues, & ideologues are equally fed-up with all who are not within their ideology, obviously.
Which is the essence of The Great Filter, in-which humankind will either lock entirely into imprint->reaction mode & simply tantrum/pogrom until all our kind is extinguished,
XOR some fraction of humankind will do all they can to lock-into considered-reasoning, & do everything they can to continue force-evolving, while surviving the apoctalyptic-nihilism of the ideologues..
I don't expect the total-war to cease until the end of this century, once it starts ( in the 2030's, probably )
Party-fascism ( which is what "communism" actually is ) & individual-fascism both are intolerant of healthy-diversity.
Collectivist-evil & individualist-evil are equal-"powers", just different in methods & in their self-programming.
.. shrug ..
_ /\ _
That's a lot of words to write for either not reading what I wrote, or not even attempting to understand it.
It's wild that I very explicitly said they're both bad and then you go on to imply that I, or people like me, think that one of these is "ok".
And that you chose to use those straw men instead of engaging with the concept of relativity of wrongness, tells me that you probably don't even really believe in that novella you wrote.
Authoritarianism is right wing.
There is no “left wing authoritarianism”. If there is authoritarianism then it is right wing.
Yes, even that country. That one, too. And that one. Now you’re starting to get it.
Rightists love to use leftist labels whenever it suits their purposes. It’s called “propaganda”.
Sure, if you use your own alternative definition of the terms, then all bets are off.
Authoritarianism is about how you're pressured or forced to do things, and left/right is about what those things are.
I know that if we get too nuanced about all the many many dimensions of politics, then we'll spend so all our time fighting semantics and get nothing done. But if you simplify down to a single axis then the terms lose all meaning and you likewise can't communicate anything of meaning.
There is 100% left wing authoritarianism, look at China today.
Statist chuds come in both flavours.
You mean fascism with red characteristics
Thoughts on "On Authority" by Engels?
These people don't read theory
If you keep asking this way, they might
Low tier garbage rant about revolutionaries vs reformists.
It’s the equivalent of a 19th century reddit rant complaining that people don’t want to bow down to authority until we’re magically all ready.
How was it wrong? Use specific citations from the text
No.
Theory is for idiots, time would be better spent on praxis than sitting around circle jerking about what we would do.
Authoritarianism is wrong yet you're correct without any room for discussion?
Would you have a discussion in favour of racism or homophobia?
I don’t engage JAQing off.
Bigotry is wrong because innocent people are presumed to be evil or guilty based on a presupposition
Give me the same line of reasoning against the text, just one, reference it directly
Engels was a bourgeoisie cunt that doesn't understand what the word "authority" means.
Can you elaborate on how he was wrong with specific citations from the text?
Here's a video full of them. I am done and fulfilled my end of this interaction. I will not fall victim to tankie sealioning.
Can you personally give me one example? Tell me roughly where it is in the text? Just one
Oh wow, authoritarianism bad? What a hot take /s
And yet look at the votes and comments.
equivocation of nazis and communists? yikes
Difference between communists and Nazis is that one of them lost a world war.
The other lost a cold war, what is your point?