this post was submitted on 16 Jan 2025
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Privacy

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Privacy has become a very important issue in modern society, with companies and governments constantly abusing their power, more and more people are waking up to the importance of digital privacy.

In this community everyone is welcome to post links and discuss topics related to privacy.

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Copied from the reddit post:

Hi all, last night, a post from last year from my personal X account suddenly became a topic of discussion here on Reddit. I want to share a few thoughts on this to provide clarity to the community on what is Proton's policy on politics going forward.

First, while the X post was not intended to be a political statement, I can understand how it can be interpreted as such, and it therefore should not have been made. While we will not prohibit all employees from expressing personal political opinions publicly, it is something I will personally avoid in the future. I lean left on some issues, and right on other issues, but it doesn't serve our mission to publicly debate this. It should be obvious, but I will say that it is a false equivalence to say that agreeing with Republicans on one specific issue (antitrust enforcement to protect small companies) is equal to endorsing the entire Republican party platform.

Second, officially Proton must always be politically neutral, and while we may share facts and analysis, our policy going forward will be to share no opinions of a political nature. The line between facts, analysis, and opinions can be blurry at times, but we will seek to better clarify this over time through your feedback and input.

The exception to these rules is on the topics of privacy, security, and freedom. These are necessarily political topics, where influencing public policy to defend these values, often requires engaging politically.

The operations of Proton have always reflected our neutrality. For example, recently we refused pressure to deplatform both Palestinian student groups and Zionist student groups, not because we necessarily agreed with their views, but because we believe more strongly in their right to have their own views.

It is also a legal guarantee under Swiss law, which explicitly prohibits us from assisting foreign governments or agencies, and allows us no discretion to show favoritism as Swiss law and Swiss courts have the final say.

The promise we make is that no matter your politics, you will always be welcome at Proton (subject of course to adherence to our terms and conditions). When it comes to defending your right to privacy, Proton will show no favoritism or bias, and will unconditionally defend it irrespective of the opinions you may hold.

This is because both Proton as a company, and Proton as a community, is highly diverse, with people that hold a wide range of opinions and perspectives. It's important that we not lose sight of nuance. Agreeing/disagreeing with somebody on one point, rarely means you agree/disagree with them on every other point.

I would like to believe that as a community there is more that unites us than divides us, and that privacy and freedom are universal values that we can all agree upon. This continues to be the mission of the non-profit Proton Foundation, and we will strive to carry it out as neutrally as possible.

Going forward, I will be posting via u/andy1011000. Thank you for your feedback and inputs so far, and we look forward to continuing the conversation.

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 7 hours ago (1 children)

Literally none of this matters and its all just noise. American politics and Americans themselves are insane.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 46 minutes ago

In the first comment after the second Proton toot, some queer woman complains about something related to the killing of people that are non-binary.

!Man, I love Mastodon.!<

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 hours ago* (last edited 5 hours ago)

IDC as long as they are not bending their knees to European countries that the EU hasn't yet kicked out. But mainly I don't care because I'm not American.

[–] MITM0 3 points 7 hours ago (1 children)

Honestly all that noise was coming from Americans anyway, not a big deal They're drama-queens. Never take Americans seriously on politics & economy (& also healthcare)

[–] [email protected] 5 points 4 hours ago

Am American. Can confirm that we are hyper reactionary. I read the tweet and shrugged it off, and rolled my eyes at the people claiming that Proton was now “dead” to them for bending the knee to Trump and were seeking out alternatives.

All of our American healthcare horror stories are true. Never take medical systems advice from us; our system is so evil and broken that our only possible recourse is “deposing” CEOs.

[–] Snapz 1 points 5 hours ago

Those calfs are looking amazing right now!!!

[–] [email protected] 26 points 13 hours ago (1 children)

a post from last year from my personal X account suddenly became a topic of discussion here on Reddit.

You mean last month right.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 5 hours ago

this is the most "i think my userbase are idiots" statement anybody could make. like do you think we dont know how time works andy? fuck you

[–] ohlaph 3 points 8 hours ago

Yeah, I pay for Proton to try it out. I was liking it but this guy bending the knee to someone like trump is a huge red flag. I won't be renewing my subscription!

[–] [email protected] 31 points 15 hours ago (2 children)

we refused pressure to deplatform both Palestinian student groups and Zionist student groups

Insane equivocation. One of those is a national and ethnic group; the other is a political movement whose pet project is currently on trial for genocide... "we refused pressure to deplatform both Jewish student groups and National Socialist student groups"

[–] [email protected] 8 points 7 hours ago (1 children)

I think that's the entire point of the comment. They are impartial even to evil. They respect privacy.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 5 hours ago

i agree with you, but the company has now invited scrutiny openly by allowing a) andy to make this tweet (personal accout or no) and b) andy to make a follow up statement using the proton reddit account. people have a distaste now, so expect to see everything you say and do to be overanalyised.

[–] Ensign_Crab 3 points 6 hours ago

“we refused pressure to deplatform both Jewish student groups and National Socialist student groups”

They are a Swiss company, yes.

[–] [email protected] 40 points 17 hours ago* (last edited 17 hours ago)

He should not have @'d Trump. By doing this he is explicitly calling for the incoming administration's attention and signalling he's willing to play ball and bend the knee. Also nice try at obfuscation saying the tweet was from last year, jackass.

Additionally the company account doubled down on his messaging. I think dems suck too, but both sides are not the same. What kind of Swiss crack are they smoking to be able to pretend that the administration that created permanent tax cuts for the ultra wealthy, that I subsidize with my tax dollars, is a friend of the little guy? Or how about the administration that seated the court that bulldozed the right to privacy, while state courts pass censorship laws under the guise of child protections?

The guy is talking out both sides of his face and he's an asshole. While I don't think this is indicative of Proton's services per se I am no longer a paying customer.

[–] IndustryStandard 19 points 15 hours ago

You can tell Andy is European because he does not understand American politics.

If you say anything positive about an American politician it means you will stan them for life and support all their actions unconventionally.

Likewise if you say anything negative about an American politician it means hate everything they stand for.

[–] [email protected] 44 points 19 hours ago (2 children)

If an employee did this and there was this much backlash that said employee would be promptly fired....

[–] UnfortunateShort 15 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

In the US maybe, in the EU? Only if you want to get sued and then forced to re-hire them.

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 14 hours ago

I'm not sure about that. There are a lot of right wingers who also use proton (ya know, like the right wing "libertarian" tech-bro types). If they remove Andy from the board, there no doubt Proton is getting labeled as "woke", they lose either way. Honestly, making political comments in the first place, is just a no-win scenario for a privacy-focused mission, which wasn't even that left-right partisan to begin with. He should have just STFU, and everything would be fine.

[–] jaggedrobotpubes 26 points 18 hours ago

I'm still confused how he could have been dumb enough to think, let alone imply, let alone say out loud, that Republicans want to reign in big tech, when they so transparently want to capture it and make it an even worse version of itself. It's not that everything they do is a cynical power grab, it's that everything they do is a blatant cynical power grab, and being in the privacy business without having a perfectly clear understanding of that feels equivalent to not knowing what a VPN is.

His statement here is great, and I support it whole-heartedly and unabashedly. It just feels almost...I don't know, unrelated somehow? Even though ostensibly it isn't.

[–] [email protected] 121 points 1 day ago (8 children)

Trouble is Andy, we now know what you privately think and all the follow up statements in the world can't put that genie back in the bottle.

Proton is an org that exists in an industry whose customers do not trust easily. Publicly aligning with someone utterly untrustable, either as an individual or as a board, has tainted Proton and adversely affected peoples ability to trust. How can we ever know when Proton will find it acceptable again to respond positively to a Trumpian decision or how it might affect our privacy?

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[–] slug 74 points 22 hours ago (1 children)

agreeing with Republicans on one specific issue (antitrust enforcement to protect small companies)

Where is he getting this bullshit from that republicans actually want to do antitrust lol

[–] [email protected] 28 points 20 hours ago

from https://lemmy.ca/comment/13913116

Two bills were ready, with bipartisan support. Chuck Schumer (who coincidently has two daughters working as big tech lobbyists) refused to bring the bills for a vote.

At a 2024 event covering antitrust remedies, out of all the invited senators, just a single one showed up - JD Vance. 

Chuck Schumer is democrat, JD Vance is republic. Would guess opinion based on personal experience with few people.

[–] [email protected] 51 points 23 hours ago (4 children)

Why does his username have "88" in binary 🧐

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 hours ago

88 was my favorite number for a long time until I found out that Nazis were using it. Bummer. I’m weirdly still sad about it.

I can’t even tell you why it was my favorite number. I think as a kid, I always heard people pick 7 and I just wanted to be different so I leaned into 8s. Idk.

Now, I struggles because I like 8s but I don’t want to be a Nazi. F’ing Nazis ruin everything.

Guess I could just like 8 or 888, haha.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

The number 8 is lucky to Chinese people. Source: I am Chinese

[–] [email protected] 4 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

Is it normal to double it up?

[–] [email protected] 9 points 14 hours ago

Yes, doubling characters or numbers is common in Chinese to insist on the item.

At weddings, you will see lots of double happiness characters for example.

"Everybody" is literally the character for people that is repeated, so "yan yan".

[–] piyuv 26 points 22 hours ago (3 children)

He might be born on 1988, although I could not verify this. He started his PhD on 2009, that’d make him 21 at that time, which is not unusual

[–] myedition8 22 points 19 hours ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 8 points 14 hours ago

Bruh, just "Andy1988" would've been a better username 🤦‍♂️

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[–] CatsGoMOW 25 points 22 hours ago

Because of fucking course it does. 🤦‍♂️😮‍💨

[–] [email protected] 72 points 1 day ago (14 children)

I'm personally satisfied with the statement, position and reflection on the issue.

It was a fuck-up to publicly respond to donaldtrump in what could be seen as an endorsement. This was acknowledged and remedied.

The no politics stance is probably unavoidable, as mentioned but they should never focus on political parties, but on defending the values, this is what is clarified and that's best. We should accept to support a bill strengthening privacy even if it may come from a political party we generally do not support. Denying our support to such a bill would not strengthen the core value we defend. And as individuals we may still criticize all other activities of such a political party if we disagree with others of their activities.

As a community, I hope we can come together, and resist the temptation of purity tests, and acknowledge that we are all fighting for the same cause, no matter our perspective on other issues. We need the support of everyone.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

we are all fighting for the same cause

Catering to the "Libertarian" neo-Nazi crowd so they buy your product vs wanting to defend minorities against these sort of people is not the same cause

[–] [email protected] 1 points 4 hours ago

You're confusing proton with our stance as a community which cares about privacy.

As a community the question is, will we shun anyone who cares about furthering our rights to privacy, because they have other stances on other issues?

Doing so is only isolating us and prevents us from making our issues heard and gathering more support across the political spectrum.

You can fight alongside someone you don't agree with on other topics. It is not an endorsement for all they stand for.

[–] piyuv 51 points 22 hours ago

His main point is outright wrong though. Republicans are not better at anti-trust, they’re the big money. Thinking Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos will protect small tech companies is laughable.

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[–] [email protected] 37 points 23 hours ago* (last edited 23 hours ago) (2 children)

Full context here for everyone.

Personally, that answer does not seem nearly enough and I believe he should step down if he truly cared about the Proton project as a whole.

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