I believe it.
People are generally ignorant of how the Kremlin, and more recently the CCP, are using social media to divide democratic countries.
this post was submitted on 01 Mar 2024
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Dumb question, but if it's so effective why dont we don't in Russia? Or if we do, why doesn't it work as well?
Idk, but the Russian propaganda blames everything on the "Collective West". Like E-V-E-R-Y-T-H-I-N-G. Even the recent murder of Navalny, who was contained in a highly isolated prison in the Arctic Circle was attributed to the US spies.
Jokes aside, I think such news was elevated externally, and it was a big deal in Russia: https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2024/01/16/7437453/
I'd like to believe that our intelligence communities do, but I don't know.
What I do know that that Russian propaganda tries to "immunize" their marks against mismatching views. One method is to pull them out of the shared media ecosystem by seeding distrust against non-aligned media. Another is to associate any undesirable viewpoints with weakness, idiocy or perversion.
Last but not least, Russia already tested a complete internet disconnect of their country so they could isolate their own population from anything not state controlled, should the tide turn or an emergency happen.
People don't have access to social media in Russia like they do in most democratic countries. They don't have as many devices, slower access, language barriers, and much bigger risk of serious problems from the government.
Also, democratic governments run by committees are less able and less willing to use this kind of tactic.
People don't have access to social media in Russia like they do in most democratic countries.
We do. About 70% of the population admit that they use VK, less use Telegram, youth uses TikTok. When Instagram wasn't banned, about 15 millions used it at least once a week.
They don't have as many devices,
We have about 300 millions of registered mobile devices - more than 2 per citizen, including newborns and elderly people.
slower access,
While it's true for now due to governmental restrictions, the monopoly of Rostelecom, and sanctions, the internet access in Russia have been developing rapidly. Ookla says that Russia has an internet speed of about 85 Mbit/s on average. This number is pretty useless in the current context when the huge amount of the traffic to Europe routes via USA servers, but still it's a good number.
language barriers, and much bigger risk of serious problems from the government.
You got this part correct!
Yes I'm not saying Russia is still in the stone age, but
- 74% smartphone owner ship in Russia vs 82% in the US.
- 73% social media penetration in Russia vs 92% in the US
Those are significant differences. People in Russia are actively protected from foreign propaganda (like banning Instagram), whereas in the US there's a heavy emphasis on free speech and access to information.
Divide and conquer, a very old tactic now possible in an entirely new way via the Internet and social media. As with many things in life, it's complicated. There are many factors... but I think we already agree anyway.
This is what we do. The USA/CIA does this every day and they are the best. Any time a South or Central American or Middle Eastern state elects someone who puts that state's interests above those of the United States, that person is doomed.
Their reputation will plummet as long as they maintain freedom of the press. And if they decide to defend themselves by restricting press freedom in a trial to stop the media from lying, they are even more doomed to fail.
Only a dictatorship like China can defend itself against American opinion-forming. But of course, life under a dictatorship has its own shortcomings. But perhaps it's better than being another piece of prey in the American portfolio, unable to counter Western arrogance and racism. There are only a few countries on earth that can be seen as accomplices of American imperialism and not as its victims.
Unfortunately, Eastern Europe was not smart enough to hold on to the changed Soviet Union under Gorbachev and become its own economic power like China.
They simply switched sides and became a bargain for Western interests. The Spoils of the Cold War. Just a market for western companies and products. Helpless at the mercy of the Americans. This is what professional propaganda can do to peoples.
While Putin tries to turn back time. Also pathetic. He will be able to destroy a lot but his country will never benefit from it.
Same. The Russian IRA follows a simple, time-tested method: do whatever you can right now, little by little.
Most of it is just simple opinion shaping (try to connect the anger of internet strangers to the EU, US, liberals or the left). The interest slowly accumulates. Spreading bedbug hysteria causes just a little harm to France's reputation, causes just a small bit of disillusion in its people and reduces Olympic revenue by maybe just some 10'000 euros -- but ever so slowly, it alters the overall course.
I don't want to sound like the soviet union nostalgic you'll find on grad. But there was a time when the KGB was supposed to be among the best secret service in the world with crazy operations. and now the best Russia can do to destabilize a democracy is⦠pretending there is some bedbugs in Paris
People have very limited bandwidth. You can only dedicate so much energy to care about things at a given moment. Bedbugs aren't a huge threat society wide, but individually they're devastating. So if you spend a bunch of personal energy and effort on making sure you don't bring bed bugs into your home, what things are you not paying attention to that normally would be a big deal?
Viral outrage campaigns don't need to be devastating on their own. Their purpose is to keep people distracted, tired, and apathetic.
The fact that you think this is an embarrassingly unsuccessful endeavor implies to me that they are doing a good job obscuring their actual objectives.
People really underestimate the psychological impact of something as seemingly annoying at best as a bug infestation.
I've encountered bedbugs over 10 years ago on holiday, luckily didn't bring them home. After all this time, the first thing I think about when something itches in bed: Bedbugs.
But they are pretty freaking good at it..
... are you saying they successfully tricked you, or that you had actual bedbugs?
They are good at destabilizing democracies. The bed bug story may play a small role in that.
Have you seen the US lately? What a shit show
Far from the best, it's only a small part of their social media propaganda effort.
Russia's systemic failures, significant as they are, will never be enough to displace their status as one of, if not, the best foreign intelligence operators. At least, not as long they're the Russian Federation.
That's not because they're magic, smarter, or genetically predisposed to being great spies. It's a function, or symptom, of their empire and how they cobbled it together with so many diverse and divergent ethnic groups, cultures, and religions.
America is a melting pot that forms a singular monoculture, more or less, but Russia is literally different nations stitched together from Europe to the opposite end of the Asian continent. It's kept together through the immense effort of their internal security services....and the occasional indiscriminate bombing campaign, but primarily their internal security services.
The continuation of the Russian empire necessitates the mass production of people for their internal security services, who also then just happen to have the same skill sets required for covert foreign intelligence work. So it's not really surprising why they excell at it, and will continue to for the foreseeable future.
Quite interesting that you are posting this on the same day some new Marsalek information came out. Don't underestimate russian intelligence
If I was still in school, Russia would be my go to homework excuse.
Sorry teach... Russia ate my homework