this post was submitted on 04 Mar 2024
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[–] [email protected] 54 points 8 months ago (6 children)

This is a shit take. This ruling is not saying "Trump did nothing wrong", this is specifically saying "States cannot unilaterally decide to remove federal election candidates from ballots", which I completely agree with. As others have noted, it would open the doors to so much bullshit if this were allowed.

The SC could come out tomorrow and say "We're disqualifying Trump", this doesn't preclude that.

[–] [email protected] 108 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (28 children)

States have always had that power. Whether its age, naturalization, or oath-breaking, it's never been up to the federal government to decide disqualification.

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[–] Maggoty 76 points 8 months ago (43 children)

States remove federal election candidates for eligibility reasons all the time. Trump is yet again getting special treatment.

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Arguably states unilaterally removing a candidate from the ballot is a major paving stone on the road to the civil war, when Lincoln won because of the split pro slave vote the south blew a gasket because it only just hit them then that everyone else had enough electors among them to ignore the south completely.

[–] Maggoty 23 points 8 months ago (2 children)

The idea that we have to let an insurrectionist campaign and win before disqualifying them is far worse. It would instantly lead to massive protests and violence from whichever party had that happen to them. If you want to avoid civil war then denial must happen early if at all.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

A lot of the Constitution assumes a level of good faith that just no longer exists among Republicans. Anyway, by my read Colorado can still make it a state law and be totally fine since there would be no conflict, they just can't use the 14th Amendment.

Ultimately, it's a stupid decision based on stupid facts, the worst kind. He hasn't yet been found guilty of insurrection, let alone in that state, so they're just sort of declaring it's true via a lesser standard. While it absolutely is true, it's asinine to use an amendment that otherwise protects fucking criminal due process to then declare in a civil case someone a criminal and disqualify them from office.

[–] jj4211 1 points 8 months ago (3 children)

That may be true, but the problem is that we really needed the federal government to actually bother to inflict consequences on Trump.

Colorado can't make the determination of insurrectionest for say North Dakota, and it's nuts if the eligibility of a president varies state to state. So the federal government has to be responsible for the determination.

Even putting that aside, only three states even tried to declare him insurrectionist. The three states didn't have even enough sway to influence the Republican race. Even to the extent they did, Republicans already declared they would caucus to sidestep the primary ballot if Trump were banned. In the general election, those states have been true blue for at least 16 years, no Republican was going to get those electoral votes anyway. It was only ever going to be a symbolic gesture even if it could stand, the federal government would have had to disqualify him in states that actually mattered for any meaningful result.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 months ago

It's not a State Law they're using to remove him. It's federal election laws. It's in the Fourteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution which was adopted on July 9, 1868, as one of the Reconstruction Amendments. They even specifically discussed if a President should have an exception and decided it did not. The Supreme Court is choosing NOT to enforce the US Federal Constitution!

[–] [email protected] 6 points 8 months ago

On the other hand, I could definitely see a bunch of red-controlled states deciding to remove Biden (or future Dem candidates) for whatever bullshit reason in the future, so while this ruling isn't necessarily consistent with current practice it at least doesn't open the door to that.

Except that R's are already pretty cool with being inconsistent about what is our isn't allowed, which is how we got certain members of the SC in the first place...

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