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"He bombed me back first"
Targeting of civilians and civilian infrastructure, mass arrests and forced removal of native populations, and indiscriminate use of chemical weapons are all war crimes. Hell, use of cluster bombs and mines have been recognized as war crimes since the mid-90s, and yet the US is the world's largest manufacturer and distributor of both.
So, nobody should be held accountable for firing on a US Navy ship sailing in international waters?
Of course someone should be held responsible. So fling a few bombs up in the air and declare anyone they land on "enemy combatants" and then we can say justice was served.
So, nobody should be held accountable for the US eagerly aiding Israel in its quest of genocide? Also, the US has been helping Saudi Arabia bomb the Houthis for almost a decade now and have created a humanitarian crisis in Yemen.
Shooting at international shipping isn't holding anyone accountable unless you hate shipping corporations. And yeah if you shoot at the military (any military) don't be surprised when they shoot back.
It's clearly made the US take notice (since they care more about trade than people's lives), so mission accomplished. How else do you propose they do it, given the limited resources they have? Take it up with the UN, where the US vetoes any resolution against israel?
I suggest they pressure Egypt to allow all aid into Gaza no matter what Israel wants.
I suggest they donate to the IRC.
I suggest they go join the people they see as comrades and fight Israel.
I do not suggest that they declare war on the entire world's shipping. Which is responsible, in part, for delivering their own Humanitarian Aid. And transferring food and energy the world over. Furthermore effectiveness at getting attention does not equal moral. I don't get to shoot at random cars on the freeway because I don't like how the next state over handles homeless people. And they don't get shoot at random ships.
Shutting down the Suez traffic does this.
"Okay, yes, you've had an enormous impact on geopolitics with a few warning shots, but have you considered starting a GoFundMe?"
Hardly the whole world. They're very clearly targeting traffic through the Red Sea. Nightmarish news for all those Israeli shipping magnets and major ports on the back end of the Mediterranean. Amazing news for ports along the southern coast of Africa. The Houthis have, with a few hundred dollars in military hardware, done what amounts to a direct cash transfer of billions of dollars from the Israeli Zionists to pro-Palestinian South Africans.
What could they possibly do that would be more effective for their allies in Gaza than this?
It's not that shutting down Suez traffic doesn't do this. It's that it's an act of war against any country moving cargo through there. It's entirely too broad.
And they haven't had an impact. Not beyond discussing it here and lining themselves up for NATO ground mission (If not a UN one). We already have a military UN mission keeping the Suez Canal open and it has been the subject of wars before. It really is that important as a logistical route. And the IRC is hardly a GoFundMe.
They could go fight the Israelis directly. Because it's not just Mediterranean. It's literally the entirety of Europe from all point east of the canal. And Europe is not going to tolerate it. The most impactful thing they get is actually the first ever foreign deployment of an EU military force.
If you consider the history of Yemen and the decade-long struggle of Houthi insurgents against a Saudi backed dictatorship, eh? They've been at war with a proxy of a proxy of the US for some time now. Might as well claim the Taliban is committing an act of war against countries moving cargo through Kabul.
95% of traffic routed from the Red Sea isn't an impact?
They are. This is a direct attack on the Israeli economy. It is costing the state billions.
It is not a direct attack. That's the entire problem. And if you define friendly countries as part of the war then you have defacto declared war on them. The only impact that's going to have is in Yemen. Europe and North America aren't going to just give up the suez canal. The Yemeni coast facing the straight is going to turn into an international occupied zone. It will cost a billion dollars a year and they'll pay it happily to keep a trillion dollars a year flowing through the canal.
Then a year later, the only people who will even remember it's an occupied zone are the same people who know there's a UN mission in Sinai to keep the Suez Canal from being shut down by war again. That's it. It's not going to crash any economies. It's not going to hurt Israel or anyone else for more than a month or two.
When you've got bombs dropping on your head, it doesn't matter whether the US is doing it via their own Navy or six layers of proxies. The explosion still hurts the same, regardless.
Absolutely. Which is why Israel declaring total war on Gaza was such a monumental misstep. You've got Palestinians in Jordan, Persians in Iran, Arabs in Iraq and Egypt and Lebanon and Syria, and now Houthis in Yemen all fighting mad.
The Red Sea is shut down entirely because the war in Gaza was recognized is increasingly seen as a war by Israel against all Muslims.
Given how much trouble US and British troops have had moving in and around Somalia, how disastrously the war in Afghanistan and Iraq ended, and how inhospitable to modern western military hardware the Yemeni mountains have proven to be, I think the question is not whether EU/NA will give up the Suez but whether they can hang on to it.
You're only furthering my point. Americans and Europeans have completely neglected how fragile the region is, simply because of this period of relative stability. Given that the UN is fracturing in the face of Old West nations feuding with BRICS states, their ability to maintain control over the peninsula is eroding in turn.
And, again, it should be noted how crazy profitable this turn of events has been for South Africa. 90% of shipping traffic formerly passing through the Suez is now passing around the Horn. That's brought a much-needed injection of cash and cargo into the region.
Similarly, the nascent BRI is seeing a flood of new commerce, as overland travel gains appeal relative to the hazardous Red Sea route.
From the standpoint of the BRICS states, this has been a windfall. They aren't under any economic pressure to tag in with EU/NA on Yemen. If anything, it appears that the South Africans are leading a diplomatic charge in their defense.
The Houthis are not directly stacking Israel. Don't twist my words. They were in response to your comment.
What you're missing is it won't be a peacekeeping mission or a nation building mission. They're going to DMZ it. Anyone in area X not in a uniform, with a weapon, gets killed.
But you're just using more and more propaganda lines so I'm going to stop here.
They are directly impacting the Israeli economy and security, by threatening a traffic lane vital for Israel's continued existence.
Getting your military advise from Douglas MacArthur? The man who threw up on the White House lawn when he found out he was heading up the war on the peninsula and suffered one of the most humiliating American military defeats since Lee surrendered at Appomattox?
Christ, its like you haven't been paying attention to the last 50 years of US military history. Aerial bombardments have never successfully secured territory. All they've done is waste $10M ordinance on $100 targets.
The Saudis have been bombing Yemen for a full decade. They're better at building tunnel networks than the fucking Gazans.
You are shitting out your doo-doo ass and refusing to acknowledge the smell.
Nobody said shit about it staying at aerial bombardments. Why do you think I'm so pissed? I know people who are going to end up there.
And it's still not impacting Israel's economy. So the ships had to go around, supply is already re-established. Nobody going through the straight is going to Israel anymore because insurance won't let them. So now the Houthis decided it's the entire Western world which is just stupid. Like pissing in the wind. They're getting people killed for nothing.
And no. MacArthur is neither here nor there. He didn't come up with the concept of a DMZ or militarized zone. I fully expect it to look like Eastern Turkey with a lot of stupid shit going on because some local dickhead though he could gain an ounce more street cred by attacking the West.
But the way, they have now explicitly attacked American cargo ships for being American. If you look at American history you know we don't back down. We only ever escalate once our civilians are being shot at. And we certainly aren't going to give up on global trade just because a random warlord decided he could control international water.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/12/31/gaza-war-costs-israel-economy/
...
Tourism flat lining isn't because of cargo ships. It's because they're fighting a war.
Come on dude. Stop trying to conflate things.
The war is why they're losing the cargo ships.
And around you go. Like a spinning top. Have a nice day. And go miss the point professionally with someone else. Anyone else.
The US no longer makes leave in place mines. They are all command detonated. That was a Clinton thing. The cluster bombs... We're actually phasing them out of our arsenal. However the US maintains they're legal as long as they're not used in urban areas. Largely because Russia and China still use them and they're very effective. We'd need to get them seriously on board to actually stop making cluster munitions.
We continue to use them on the Korean divide, probably the most heavily mined place on earth. And while we've definitely updated our arsenal, I would not bet my life on the reliability of these ostensibly more advanced systems.
Sure. By selling them to our allies.
Well, they're cheap by tonnage, which is why the Russians love them. But they're also unreliable, which is what makes them so dangerous. They don't always detonate where they land, and that makes them function as land mines after the fact. They are only "effective" in the sense that they're explosive devices that litter a large area.
As to China, when was the last time they bombed anyone? Like, at all? To my knowledge, the Chinese haven't been involved in a war since they signed a peace deal with Vietnam in the 70s. The closest we've seen has been police actions along border territories (Xinjiang getting a bunch of jihadist spillover from Afghanistan, slap fights with Indian border guard counterparts, etc). Who have they been dropping cluster bombs on, in living memory even?
The DMZ landmines have been there for 70 years and de-mining that would come with serious risks of sniper attacks, ambushes, and nuclear war. Yeah it really ramps up that quick over there. All we need is for the Hermit King to think we're clearing breach routes and Seoul goes up. So yeah we're not removing those.
Even under the Trump administration we're sticking to "non-permanent" landmines. The most prominent and widespread of which is the command activated claymore.
Most of our allies are also getting rid of cluster bombs. And when Ukraine specifically asked for them we hesitated to sell them. The reason we did so is because of parity in that war. And while they aren't reliable enough to leave the area safe of UXO, they are extremely reliable at destroying military equipment.
China matters because they're constantly threatening military action.