this post was submitted on 13 Jun 2024
441 points (97.6% liked)

News

23304 readers
3683 users here now

Welcome to the News community!

Rules:

1. Be civil


Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.


2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.


Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.


3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.


Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.


4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.


Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.


5. Only recent news is allowed.


Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.


6. All posts must be news articles.


No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.


7. No duplicate posts.


If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.


8. Misinformation is prohibited.


Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.


9. No link shorteners.


The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.


10. Don't copy entire article in your post body


For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] FlyingSquid 2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Again, this suggests that you cannot be cishet and bigoted against queer people. That the only people bigoted against queer people are themselves queer. Therefore anything someone who is cishet says about queer people no matter how offensive cannot be homophobic by virtue of having been said by a cishet person.

That's just basic extrapolation from such reasoning.

[–] nomous 1 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

anything someone who is cishet says about queer people no matter how offensive cannot be homophobic by virtue of having been said by a cishet person

No, because the moment they say something homophobic they're queer thus not cishet, though they can still be bigots, it's a Catch-22, that's the point, to call the bigot the thing they hate.

[–] FlyingSquid 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Except that the person saying the homophobic thing knows they aren't queer. Which means what they said can't possibly be homophobic.

Let me put it this way- there is zero evidence that Charlie Kirk is anything but cishet. Now... we can draw attention to the issue of bigotry by just pointing out that he's a bigot or we can put the blame of bigotry on queer people themselves in some silly attempt at a gotcha.

I would say that the former is both less childish and less harmful to queer people.

[–] nomous 1 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

Except that the person saying the homophobic thing knows they aren’t queer.

Do they though do their peers? Does anyone? Again sexual fluidity is extremely common throughout our lives.

Let me put it this way- there is zero evidence that Charlie Kirk is anything but cishet.

I honestly can't imagine him being with a woman so I disagree.

Now… we can draw attention to the issue of bigotry by just pointing out that he’s a bigot

Yes.

or we can put the blame of bigotry on queer people themselves in some silly attempt at a gotcha.

I would say we put it on the bigot that said it, Charlie Kirk and not on any broad groups at all.

I would say that the former is both less childish

It's fun to be childish sometimes.

and less harmful to queer people.

I'm not sure it harms queer people at all Squid.

[–] FlyingSquid 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

See, again, you're saying that the only people who are homophobic are queer and it's no different from saying the only people who are ableist are disabled or the only people who are antisemitic are Jewish. I wish you could understand that.

[–] nomous 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I can understand how it could be interpreted that way but that's not what I mean at all.

Out of curiosity, what percentage of homophobia do you think is caused by latent homosexuality?

[–] FlyingSquid 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

It doesn't matter if it's not what you mean unless you express what you mean explicitly.

And people don't say that explicitly. They just say that every time someone says something homophobic in the news, they're closeted. Every time.

And how the hell am I supposed to know what percentage? More than zero and less than 100?

I'm guessing closer to zero than 100 for the same reason there are antisemitic Jews out there but the vast majority of antisemites aren't Jewish. Can you point to a time that you've suggested that an antisemite is actually a Jew? And if not, why not if it's so common for homophobes to be queer?

[–] nomous 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

And how the hell am I supposed to know what percentage? More than zero and less than 100?

Seems pretty relevant to the discussion, 10% is way different than 90%.

I’m guessing closer to zero than 100

But you're just guessing.

for the same reason there are antisemitic Jews out there but the vast majority of antisemites aren’t Jewish.

What reason is that?

Can you point to a time that you’ve suggested that an antisemite is actually a Jew? And if not, why not if it’s so common for homophobes to be queer?

I'm sure I never said that, I usually call antisemites Nazis/bigot/fuckhead or something similar.

And if not, why not if it’s so common for homophobes to be queer?

We've already been over this. I suspect we're not going to come to an agreement on this,, have a nice night Squid.

[–] FlyingSquid 1 points 5 months ago

We haven't already been over this. All you've said is sexuality is a spectrum.

Disability is a spectrum. Everyone has their own little disabilities. So if you use an ableist word like the R-word, you're disabled. Based on your own reasoning. And you still don't see it.