Man, stadiums are nearly up there with golf courses as "useless applications of urban land" aren't they.
this post was submitted on 12 Aug 2023
297 points (95.1% liked)
Fuck Cars
9683 readers
1305 users here now
A place to discuss problems of car centric infrastructure or how it hurts us all. Let's explore the bad world of Cars!
Rules
1. Be Civil
You may not agree on ideas, but please do not be needlessly rude or insulting to other people in this community.
2. No hate speech
Don't discriminate or disparage people on the basis of sex, gender, race, ethnicity, nationality, religion, or sexuality.
3. Don't harass people
Don't follow people you disagree with into multiple threads or into PMs to insult, disparage, or otherwise attack them. And certainly don't doxx any non-public figures.
4. Stay on topic
This community is about cars, their externalities in society, car-dependency, and solutions to these.
5. No reposts
Do not repost content that has already been posted in this community.
Moderator discretion will be used to judge reports with regard to the above rules.
Posting Guidelines
In the absence of a flair system on lemmy yet, let’s try to make it easier to scan through posts by type in here by using tags:
- [meta] for discussions/suggestions about this community itself
- [article] for news articles
- [blog] for any blog-style content
- [video] for video resources
- [academic] for academic studies and sources
- [discussion] for text post questions, rants, and/or discussions
- [meme] for memes
- [image] for any non-meme images
- [misc] for anything that doesn’t fall cleanly into any of the other categories
Recommended communities:
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
If they get self-sustaining regular use they build community.
NFL stadiums that get used 30 nights a year are ridiculous.
30?? A city would be lucky if they got that much use out of their stadium
Stadiums like this use their parking lot for commuters during the week and for the games on the weekends. I live here, the hockey arena, baseball stadium, and football stadium all share lots/garages that are always full during the week too
We also have shit public transit so almost everyone is driving cars downtown from the burbs
Wait that's it? Up in Canada our hockey stadiums get used for minor league teams, lacrosse, concerts, and all kinds is variety events. You ONLY play hand egg in them?
Football stadiums get used for concerts as well.
It's just rare that a big enough band is in town that can fill 70k seats.
Taylor swift is doing her concerts at football stadiums, for instance.
That must suck so hard.
I've been to a couple in football stadiums. I much prefer a 5000 or less venue.
But you're not going to get big bands going to that size venue, unfortunately
they build ~~community~~ brands
I get community from my local sportsball fan club. We get together, sing, gripe/gloat about how we're doing, and watch each other's lives develop as we hang out at the tailgates year after year.
The other season ticket holders and I recognize each other by this point even if we haven't talked; wearing a team hat in public can start a conversation.
It may not be a type of community you care to participate in, but it is one.
Stadiums are ok, but they're usually surrounded by massive multiples worth of parking.
This. Here in Europe they usually have transit stops and (very) little parking (by American standards). In Bucharest they close down the whole Road anyway when there's a match.
Pretty sure a large green space is infinitely better for the health of a city than a stadium complex.
It's like they put in so many roads to get "there" that "there" doesn't exist anymore.
More parking will clearly improve this. It isn’t completely paved yet.
No wonder there's a housing crisis
They did San Jose and Sacramento like that, too. Destroyed the waterfronts and huge neighborhoods.
Hey, it's my city!
What's the solution? I'd love if those giant interstates were replaced by parks and green space, but I don't know how I'd get anywhere without a car. I live 15 miles or so south of the city so public transit wouldn't work and my bike is really only useful for the grocery and a few other local stores.
Genuinely curious what a non-car solution is for those outside of urban centers.
A large part of the problem (at least in North America) is exclusionary and Euclidean zoning, as shown here. On the vast majority of urban land in the US and Canada, it's literally illegal to build anything besides a detached single-family house. Not even a townhouse. Not even a duplex. Not even a corner store. Not even a local grocer.
In addition, other deed restrictions such as setback requirements, lot minimums, lot coverage maximums, and parking minimums artificially reduce density even further.
And the reason I'm talking about density is because density is exactly why public transit is so infeasible for most suburbs -- when you have this artificially low-density sprawling suburbia, basically nothing but driving is practical.
The traditional style of building American cities was the streetcar suburb, where walkable, mixed-use neighborhoods of missing middle housing were served by dense networks of streetcars. But many of these neighborhoods (as shown in the picture above) were literally demolished to make way for the automobile, and the streetcar lines were torn up. One of the few cities in the western world that didn't tear up its streetcar network -- Melbourne, Australia -- has the largest tram network in the world to this day.
The bad news is it won't be easy to make our cities transit-oriented and walkable again. But the good news is it will be easier than making them car-oriented in the first place. Why? Because we had to literally demolish our cities and rebuild them for the car. And we did that only 60 years ago. To fix our cities, we just need to abolish the laws (like zoning and parking minimums) that legally enforce low-density sprawl, which will allow infill to occur organically, replacing parking lots in city centers with housing and businesses. Additionally, it would be wise to tax land to further incentivize that infill and disincentivize land hoarding and speculation. And of course build more transit and bike infrastructure to support the new density.
Edit: Bonus points, as restrictive zoning (and other deed restrictions) are the primary contributors to the housing crisis. Eliminating them and allowing more housing to be built would alleviate the housing crisis, grow the economy, and reduce inequality. There is overwhelming evidence that loosening onerous zoning laws contains housing price growth.
Thank you for the thoughtful and detailed explanation. Now my Sunday morning will involve the rabbit hole of info you just provided.
bottom image is abhorrent. those roads would get backed up quick. WE NEED MORE LANES
ASEAN countries have more or less similar problems as in America. It's so infuriating having to compete with other traffics while sitting on a bus, not withstanding with all the show-off kids that ride their fancy cars or motorcycles.
Wow it turned color!! But in all seriousness I'm amazed at how many communities were wiped out by this. No wonder we can't have good public transit! We could have but then we displaced everyone with highways
All according to plan
There's barely any city left