Why Don't EVs Come With Spare Tires? : electricvehicles

[–] [email protected] 7 points 6 days ago

Our EV doesn't have a spare, which I wasn't concerned about as I've had maybe two flats in my driving history and one of those I just pumped up and drove to the tyre shop for a repair.

What did catch me out recently was not having a jack. It makes sense though - car has no spare, so why include a jack?

We got a screw in the tyre a few weeks back and it was leaking too bad to pump up for even a short drive. I figured I'd jack up the car, take off the rim, and take it in the wife's car to the tyre joint.

Things to note:

No jack, as mentioned. Went to the local auto store and bought a pretty mid range scissor jack that looked like every other car jack I've ever used.
EVs are really bloody heavy. A standard 1600KG scissor jack could barely move the thing. Went back and bought a much heavier duty trolley jack.
A 3200KG trolley jack makes lifting the car easy, but the jack itself is huge and leaves no space on the lifting points to put jack stands.
An EV is really stiff - lifting the rear passenger side resulted in every wheel except the front drivers side coming off the ground.

Didn't want to leave it perched on a jack and a single wheel, so took the tyre off and ended up replacing the screw in the hole that was leaking with a bigger screw... Then pumping it up and driving it to the tyre joint.

Moral of the story - might be easier to just carry a small selection of different sized screws and a screw driver.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 6 days ago

The number of people who would even know how to change a tyre is unfortunately decreasing. Manufacturers therefore have less reason to include something that requires allocating space, carrying extra weight, and a small extra cost for each car, because they know not enough people are going to care about the loss of a spare to make a difference to sales. I'd wager this is particularly true for EVs as they seem to attract a lot of people who are scared of basic maintenance. It's pretty poor of a company to not include a spare on something that's advertised for use on dirt though, even if the model in question doesn't actually seem like something that its buyers will actually take off the tar.

I personally would want a proper full sized spare in any of my vehicles, though I'm prepared to make an exception for my motorbikes due to the obvious logistical problems. Space savers are better than nothing but then you have to deal with speed restrictions and having to change wheels twice if you get a flat on the front. It's rare for me to get a puncture but it's nice to know that I can just quickly change wheels and carry on even if I somehow managed to put a big gash in a tyre or bend a rim. Even for just a basic puncture in town I can't imagine wanting to faff around on the side of a road for ages waiting for roadside assistance to come and fix something I could have done myself and been back on the road in 15 minutes.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 6 days ago

My Audi E-tron has a full size spare.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Don't most EVs have an empty storage area where the engine usually is on normal cars? Just stick a spare in there.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 6 days ago

It's too small for a rim and tyre.

[–] [email protected] 40 points 1 week ago (4 children)

most new cars dont, its wild

[–] [email protected] 4 points 6 days ago

Ours didn't. It had some bullshit to spray into the tyre to do a repair. That failed, and made it unrepairable to boot.

So now we have a spare. Have a spare. It can a slimline one, it just needs to get you to a garage.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 days ago

Enshittification isn't exclusive to software it seems

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Do they come with runflats? I dunno what's common anymore.

My 2013 Volvo doesn't have a spare, but it makes use of runflats instead, and that was considered a luxury back then.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Lots of new cars just give you a bottle of fix-a-flat and a "fuck you"

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

There a number of arguments as to why this is the case and the article touches on these:

One could make an argument that most drivers don't use their spare (or don't know how) and would call for roadside service anyway.
Another argument is that the extra weight of the spare has to be hauled around for months or years before it gets used, if ever, and fuel is used for that extra weight costing the owner and increasing carbon emissions.
More pragmatically the most likely answer is the auto makers found out they could simply stop giving out spare tires and it doesn't cost them any customers, and increases the auto maker's profits. Some will even sell you a spare tire at an extra fee meaning even more revenue.

My guess is of all these reasons, the third answer, cash grab is the real answer. The author gives us one sentence, but agrees with me.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Another argument is that the extra weight of the spare has to be hauled around for months or years before it gets used, if ever, and fuel is used for that extra weight costing the owner and increasing carbon emissions.

For me this makes sense, driving for 20 years and not used a spare tire once, hyundai also offers 24x7 road assist

touch wood!

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 week ago (4 children)

I don't believe you've never had a flat in 20 years. I get a flat every three or four years.

[–] Coreidan 10 points 1 week ago (1 children)

What the hell are you doing that results in a flat every few years? This is NOT normal.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I drive a pickup truck and I go to pickup truck kind of places with it like lumber yards, industrial suppliers, landfills and other high FOD locations. I get more flat tires because I drive where the nails are.

My sedan goes to the grocery store and a few restaurants and has never had a flat.

[–] Coreidan 1 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (1 children)

So the guy you’re responding to most likely doesn’t drive through lumber and construction sites all day. Most people don’t. That’s why most people don’t have 20 flats a week from driving around in nails.

You ever think maybe you’re an exception because of your habits that most people don’t have?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Hence why I said "my sedan that [pretty much stays on normal roads] has never had a flat."

[–] Coreidan -1 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (1 children)

Then why are you surprised the person you’re responding to hasn’t had a flat?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 6 days ago (1 children)

I'm...not?

[–] Coreidan -2 points 6 days ago (1 children)

I don't believe you've never had a flat in 20 years.

Oh ok. 👍

[–] [email protected] 3 points 6 days ago

You're quoting@[email protected] and not me.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 week ago

My commute has always been at least 20 miles, and I've had 1 flat tire in 10 years. That one was a nail I ran over in a construction site, which tbh is to be expected.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 week ago (1 children)

They didn't say they never had a flat. They said they never used the spare. For many, calling roadside assistance is the solution to a flat tire. @[email protected] it sounds like that has been a workable solution.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 week ago (2 children)

wtf is roadside assistance?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 days ago

Ever heard of AAA?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 week ago (1 children)

This is probably regional/country term. In the USA it means calling for a technician to drive a vehicle to your location and service the flat tire (or provide a replacement) at the roadside when you find you have a flat. What would the term be for that in your region?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I'm in the US, and it's not something I've heard of. Is it available for everybody, or do you have to pay extra for it?

Maybe this is just another poverty thing because I only drive beaters and have the absolute cheapest insurance.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

I'd say it comes in three different forms:

Manufacturer provided - As poster irk pointed out, they have a Hyundai and as part of the purchase it includes this service. I believe Tesla provides it for free during the warranty period. Ford gives it for free for 12 months from purchase. etc
Auto club/subscription - This would be like AAA (or CAA in Canada). You pay an annual fee and get the service
Car insurance provided - Lots of auto insurance companies include this in their policies or offer it for a substantial discount. Some auto companies operate their own fleet of roadside assistance vehicles (I think I've see Progressive trucks do this at one point). Other auto insurance companies will contract with a fleet management company. They'll give you a number to call and a technician will be dispatched to your location and the insurance company takes care of the bill. This is what I had at one point and I think it costs me something like $20/year.

Maybe this is just another poverty thing because I only drive beaters and have the absolute cheapest insurance.

Until a few years ago, I always changed and maintained my own tires. A $10 tire plug kit saved me hundreds of dollars over replacing tires whenever I had a flat.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 week ago

Okay, so none of those options are available to me. The only option my insurance offers is that they'll come by and change your tire, but only if you already have a spare available.

I'm out in a farming/mining area, and the debris on the roads always chews up the tires badly enough that a plug kit won't work. I just get the tires resurfaced with new treads when they get worn out badly enough.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 week ago (1 children)

never had a flat :)

tbf i only drive around 10km a day but the last time was when i was a kid back in 1995

maybe have just been lucky

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 week ago

Maybe that's it. I've got a 40km commute each day.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 week ago (2 children)

I dont think its that unreasonable. A flat tire happens so rarely, and for most people, they can just call a tow truck. For most, I dont think its worth carting a tire and wheel around for potentially zero use over the life of the car.

Some people definitely need spares, but realistically, most dont.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

My minivan has a donut spare that is stored under the car (inside a cover). Super easy to get to, and never in the way. The tire and winch mechanism together adds maybe 30lbs of extra weight.

I'd rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. I couldn't imagine the embarrassment of having to call a fucking tow truck because of a flat tire.

[–] Coreidan 7 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Ya. Emergencies are rare so why bother being prepared.

Calling a tow truck isn’t a solution.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Your being sarcastic, but yes. A flat tire is rare, and minimal impact. Not preparing for it is perfectly reasonable. If you are in a situation where a flat is high impact (driving into the bush, etc) then you need a solution, and you should prepare for that.

But for the vast majority of drivers, and especially EV drivers, a tow truck is actually a solution, because they are almost always in a metropolitan area.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 6 days ago (2 children)

This assumes you don't leave a major city though. Start driving in the county side and you'll find there are dead zones. Go drive in the Rockies and you'll find quite a few areas that have no cell reception.

[–] slazer2au 6 points 6 days ago (1 children)

And carrying a spare makes sense in those situations. Where as someone who drives in a city or suburbs with acceptable mobile coverage doesn't need the spare.

[–] [email protected] -5 points 6 days ago

You mean ride a bus?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 days ago (1 children)

You clearly didnt read the post, let me highlight the two statements that make your comment unreaasonable:

If you are in a situation where a flat is high impact (driving into the bush, etc) then you need a solution, and you should prepare for that.

Firstly the address the possibility of driving in remote areas and state you need to prepare in that case

But for the vast majority of drivers, and especially EV drivers, a tow truck is actually a solution, because they are almost always in a metropolitan area.

And then point out for the vast majority of EV drivers that isn't in their risk profile

So your whining about "whaddabout da rockieezz" shows you simply didnt read or comprehend.

You're being like the idiots who whine "but I need to drive a thousand miles in one go while towing a 6ton trailer so an EV is useless for everyone on the planet because it doesn't work for me"

[–] [email protected] -1 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (2 children)

Wow, so not driving in a major city is now "driving in the bush". Also, driving outside a major city is also = to towing a 6ton trailer.

It literally couldn't be to see family that don't live in the same city, going to another major city, camping in well maintained national parks, going to an amusement park that isn't in a major city.. Nope, it's either major city or hauling giant trailers.

Hint, maybe you should go out sometime and see how short sighted your vague definitions and answers really are.

Forgot to add that quite a few airport long term parking lots don't have signal either, and with most being fully automatic, this doesn't end up well. But hey, this must be also considered "driving in the bush"/"hauling 6ton trailers", huh?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Hint, maybe you should go out sometime and see how short sighted your vague definitions and answers really are.

How moronic. If you think cellphones stop working once you leave major Metropolitan areas, maybe it is you that needs to actually get out and go somewhere. You think amusement parks and airports don't have cell coverage and that a flat tire in one of these places means you're stranded and alone? Jesus christ.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 6 days ago

Mate I grew up on a cattle station where the next nearest house was a 100km away. I know what living in tge boondocks is.

I also know that this use case is a very small minority of people, AND HE ALREADY addressed your minority issue.

You can keep trying to be hard done by or accept that your situation is representative of less than 1% of EV sales

[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 days ago (1 children)

How is a flat tire an emergency?

[–] Bytemeister 2 points 6 days ago

In the city, not much of one. Rural roads with bad cell coverage at night in the dead of winter? Life or death situation.

That being said, I think a spare is unnecessary for 99% of drivers. In ~20 years of driving, I've only used a spare maybe 3 times, and those were more for convenience than necessity. My last car just had a pump, and I got a screw it in. I just aired it up and drove to the tire shop. After that I bought a plug kit for a quick roadside repair.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

The last time I shopped for a car, I eliminated two vehicles from selection because of this. I won't have a car that doesnt offer a spare.

[–] Bytemeister -1 points 6 days ago (1 children)

You know you can just buy a spare and stick it in the car...

[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 days ago

Sure, and I'm also free to vote with my wallet. I want a spare to come with the vehicle, and I want it integrated.

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