this post was submitted on 02 Feb 2024
88 points (90.7% liked)

Fediverse

28389 readers
705 users here now

A community to talk about the Fediverse and all it's related services using ActivityPub (Mastodon, Lemmy, KBin, etc).

If you wanted to get help with moderating your own community then head over to [email protected]!

Rules

Learn more at these websites: Join The Fediverse Wiki, Fediverse.info, Wikipedia Page, The Federation Info (Stats), FediDB (Stats), Sub Rehab (Reddit Migration), Search Lemmy

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
 

Meta is treading carefully, doing a phased implementation while continuing conversations with Fediverse leaders. This will give the company more time to iron out some of the integration kinks. “Do we adapt the protocol to be able to support this?” Lambert asks. “Or do we try to do some kind of interesting, unique implementation?” For example, Threads supports audio posts, a feature not currently supported within ActivityPub, so Meta is experimenting with “federating” a text transcription of the original post instead of the audio version.

It was never a good idea federating with Threads

top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 43 points 9 months ago (2 children)

For as long as this article is, it is remarkably free of journalism. It is basically a press release from Meta saying that they're planning to implement Threads in a few months, and don't feel like saying more about it than that.

“Do we adapt the protocol to be able to support this?” Lambert asks. “Or do we try to do some kind of interesting, unique implementation?”

This is a fascinating question, both in its lack of an answer, and in the inherent framing of the question that of course they're going to introduce incompatibilities, and the discussion is simply about how to do it.

Mastodon allows some artistic nudity

...

Additionally, specifics are still murky regarding exactly how user data will be handled after the connections between networks are established. For example, if you federate a post from Threads and decide to delete it afterwards, what happens to the cached post on the servers of the other networks?

That... is not the central question that's on people minds about how user data will be handled. Presumably you were in a position to ask Rachel Lambert, the product manager at Meta who started the company's journey towards interoperability, a more obvious and salient question, and include in your article her response.

Meta is treading carefully, doing a phased implementation while continuing conversations with Fediverse leaders.

Who are these leaders and what are they saying about this? This, also, seems like it would have been pertinent information to include. If Meta's answer was "You're not allowed to know that at present," then including that response seems like it would have made the article quite a bit more informative than simply pretending it didn't occur to you to ask for any details about this.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Mastodon allows some artistic nudity

This is akin to saying "the Internet allows some artistic nudity". Like, what do they think Mastodon is? Who is allowing it? "Mastodon" also allows hardcore porn. Or it doesn't. Or moderation is spotty. Or it's collapsed behind a warning.

Journalists, do like the barest minimum of research before simply relaying statements from company spokespeople.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (2 children)

Yeah, the whole article is like that. Not only is the writer apparently clueless enough to get basic facts about Mastodon wrong, but each one is wrong with a flavor of a Facebook-favoring way (like implying in several different subtle ways that Mastodon includes some sort of harmful behavior or some limitation, and we need to carefully monitor to make sure it doesn't negatively impact any Facebook users, and that's the issue). And, there's absolutely no curiosity or follow-up question even after statements that are clearly inviting them.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Funny thing is that the mainstream threads audience would probably do more harm to the mastodon ecosystem by orders of magnitude.

There is a big cultural disconnect. I’m active in both and they are very different communities by and large.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago

Wired used to have actual journalists. How far they have fallen...

[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago

Absolutely spot on teardown of this joke article.

[–] hightrix 27 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Are these audio only posts? That sounds like a terrible direction for the fediverse to go. We already have enough videos of people staring at their phone while talking.

Did everyone forget how to read?

Yes, I read the bit about transcription.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 9 months ago (1 children)

the cool part is we dont have to care about the audio piece. its not being federated: i dont give a shit.

[–] hightrix 9 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Oh no, I totally agree.

My comment is more on the trend of where general social media seems to be heading.

That said, as long as we can continue to ignore… great!

[–] [email protected] 26 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

For example, Threads supports audio posts, a feature not currently supported within ActivityPub(...)

Laughs in Funkwhale, Castopod, and even any ActivityPub platform implementing an Audio object type

Wired checked no Meta claim against reality.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago

Even Misskey is allowing exact audio object type.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 9 months ago (3 children)

For example, Threads supports audio posts, a feature not currently supported within ActivityPub, so Meta is experimenting with “federating” a text transcription of the original post instead of the audio version.

Here we go

[–] [email protected] 35 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

Embrace Extend Extinguish

       ^

   we are here
[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago (1 children)

they modified AP already? wow that was quick. i was under this crazy impression they were using text in a field designed for text. silly me!

[–] [email protected] 14 points 9 months ago (1 children)

No the next step is saying that text transcription didn't worked like they wanted so we need to change the AP to allow what the majority wants(spoiler: they are the majority)

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago (2 children)

i didnt know they could unilaterally change AP for everyone. who let them have that right?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I'm just joking, I don't think they can make a change unilaterally easily.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago (1 children)

that is one of my only actual concerns. he who controls the protocol, controls the 'verse.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago (1 children)

It's far worse. They're making improvements only on their side. The protocol everyone uses will lack the features their protocol offers. In other words, their side of the garden is now greener than ours, and one day, their side will be so majestic and beautiful compared to ours that almost nobody will want to visit it anymore, and like a flame without fuel, the Fediverse will Extinguish on its own.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago (4 children)

Ha.. no.

As I said before, their instance and it's bells and whistles are irrelevant to my instance. Me and my instance only care about The ap protocol. I have no reason to fear their instance as long as it's pumping out the standard protocol. Anything not standard gets dropped.

Zero problem here.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (2 children)

Oh, be assured that threads will one day defederate and build a wall so you can't access their content anymore. The Fediverse need to have a critical mass of users to survive when it happens, but if the features threads offers are too compelling and the majority of the new accounts are made in there then the Fediverse is screwed.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago

Oh, be assured that threads will one day defederate and build a wall so you can’t access their content anymore.

Isn't that already the case? The Fediverse is doing fine under current circumstances.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago (2 children)

You can have a look at this article

https://ploum.net/2023-06-23-how-to-kill-decentralised-networks.html

Long story short, Google killed XMPP back in the days by federating with it, then added some non standard features, got most of the user base to migrate to Google chat, then defederated.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago

You can attach an audio file to a post on mastodon and it gets an embedded player. Just federate a compatible audio file?

https://mastodon.art/@Ossi/111138453327480717

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago

i dont get the fear here. if they are putting text into a field designed for text, thats somehow an extension of AP?

[–] [email protected] 21 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Fediverse leaders? Like John Mastodon?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago (1 children)

The article's paywalled, but presumably they're talking to active developers and people who run large instances.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago

I think it's doubtful that they actually are. If they were actually reaching out to any Mastodon "leaders," I think the leaders would be saying something about it and posting the communications.

[–] HootinNHollerin 11 points 9 months ago

Lots of furries in their future I’d suppose

[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago (7 children)

i guess ill say it again. meta hasnt modified the protocol, and the bells and whistles they feed their own users on their own instance means nothing to the rest of the 'verse. calm the fuck down

[–] [email protected] 10 points 9 months ago

calm the fuck down

What, and miss out on the delicious dopamine that comes from being part of a mob gripped by righteous anger? This is a chance to be mad at the same thing that everyone else is mad at, risk-free.

load more comments (6 replies)
[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago (3 children)

How is audio different from other media types (e.g. images, videos, etc) that it isn’t / couldn’t be supported by activity pub?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago

I don't know. Mastodon already supports audio posts, how does that federate? Why can't Threads do the same thing?

[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago

it's EEE. want to see all of your friend's posts? sign up for Threads by Meta today!

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago

Pretty sure it's not. Wired is just talking about the wrong thing. Currently threads voice posts federate fine.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago (3 children)

I keep seeing people hating on the EEE crowd. Finally meta makes a move that proves we were right.

[–] Plopp 3 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (3 children)

EEE?

Edit: When did people start referring to embrace, extend, extinguish as EEE? I've heard of the term plenty for the past ~24 years but never seen this acronym before? Ah well...

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago

Embrace, extend, extinguish

[–] fadhl3y 2 points 9 months ago (5 children)

embrace, extend, execute

What Microsoft tried to do to Java in the 2000's

load more comments (5 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 6 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Another big, lingering question is why Meta wants to do this in the first place. Lambert says Meta wants to give users more control over their posts and followers, with easier avenues to engage across platforms.

So will they be implementing a method to export this data in ways that could be imported to other platforms? Otherwise I don't see where federation fits in here all that much.

Extending reach isn't really the same as control imo.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

"Meta will play nice" the shills said.

"They won't EEE you're being paranoid", they said.

"They'll follow the standard", they said.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Besides the obvious repulsion for anything Meta, that's a novel thing to see, I'm kinda curious to see what happens with the user reception of these audio posts

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago (1 children)

It sounds annoying as fuck. I hate when my friends send audio messages in messaging apps.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago (3 children)

Sorry for the n00b question, but how does a more “redditesque” Lemmy work with a more “twitteresque” service, and vice versa?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago

Both use activity pub protocol. Mastodon and lemmy already work somewhat well together.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago

It doesn't, this is pretty much just for them linking with Mastodon.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments
view more: next ›