this post was submitted on 27 Feb 2025
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Isn't the point of desktops to already be modular?
The funny thing about this new framework is that it isnt
Jup, soldered in RAM. They're less modular than most laptops
Right. Of all the products the company known for repairability and upgradability could have developed, they went into a class of products that didn't need it and removed it.
In their defense though, this was a product class that was missing. If you're an idiot and care at all about AI, this will be an excellent product for that with the 256GBPS RAM bandwidth at half the price of an Apple product.
So maybe they're like Lambo and Porsche who sell giant SUVs to fund the development of their sports cars.
No one should buy this but as long as they keep selling repairable laptops, it's ok I guess.
Yeah finally watched the review. Weird, but also, this is actually a really exciting chip.
If you do any kind of work with ml, this might just about be your only option for breaking 16gb vram, which is the floor for many models. Very few of us ever even get to experiment with something above 40. With these, you could take it to 128, and it seems, at a pretty price competitive standpoint.
I'm looking at it pretty seriously, because I was really excited about these chips, but almost completely disinterested in them as far as a laptop chip. But for a desktop chip? I mean if its at 128gb vram, the fuck else can I ask for?
I'm also super interested in that 2:1. For mobile computing thats pretty much my go-to these days, is a thin and light 2:1 that I just use to get access to where-ever my compute is actually happening.
Maximum allocation of 96GB to VRAM on the 128GB configuration, but your point still stands. This desktop was absolutely designed almost specifically for ML-enthusiasts, and if you wanna run a game on it you can too. Describing it as a "gaming PC" is totally missing the mark.
EDIT: it has been pointed out that the 96GB limit is a Windows limitation, so wouldn't affect any serious ML-enthusiast
The 96GB limit is just for Windows. It can be taken higher on Linux.
96GB on Windows, configurable to more on Linux.
I wouldn't necessarily say it was designed specifically for ML people though the 128GB spec will definitely draw in that crowd, the 32GB model is $1,099 and competes well in the small but very real "Gaming NUC" space that's been dominated by Intel/Nvidia laptop gear in tiny desktop cases. Asus took over the NUC line, and the gaming models are priced way above this without the same ML draw of unified RAM.
Oh, interesting! That's the first I'm hearing of being able to configure more in Linux, seems like anyone taking ML seriously would be using Linux anyway.
Thanks for that correction.
96gb of VRAM? Even most ML professionals have never seen that much vram in their life.
Yeah to me this is like SGI marketing their computers as gaming PCs
Im curious what kind of practical application an individual might even have for ML?
That seems like the only legitimate use-case for this device, but also I consider most (not all) ML illegitimate and pointless at the same time.
Myopia is a curable disease. Why should I bother treating someone so intentionally ignorant with the grace of charity?
Im just going to interpret that unwarranted rude response as not having an answer. I did not ask for charity, I asked a question.
Charity is precisely what you are asking for.
Brother I don't need a Wikipedia link to know what charity is. I'm a native English-speaking adult. That aint it.
I mean apparently you do, considering you don't know what you are asking. You are asking me to make a preposterously generous interpretation of your question, when you yourself can't be bothered to even consider what might be a useful application of ml. Give _ me _ a _ break.
Go sort things on an abacus and get away from anything related to computation you Luddite.
Hey fellow autist, this isn't a good look. Tone it down a bit.
I mean apparently you do, since you don't know what I'm asking.
Its also not a gaming device, as it doesnt have a dedicated gpu. It only has an APU and some AI core bullshit. Its worthless e waste and not really fit for this community imo.
That is some acrobatic gatekeeping of a GPU that is similar to the PS5 in terms of performance.
The top model should be far more powerful than a PS5.
Yeah no, you will not be gaming any modern 3D game on that. A game console also cant be compared to a desktop machine like this properly in terms of software optimization.
lol, lmao
So its just a standard rasterization gpu with some extra AI label slapped on it then? Because then buying this is even dumber than i thought. Might aswell just buy a standard gpu for half the money with double the performance.
Mate, I can't see the goalposts anymore you've moved them so far.
I admit i didnt even look at the specs of that thing, because i have trained myself to see anything with an AI label on it as worthless scams. So yeah i guess you can game on it, but its the worst value gaming device i have ever seen. So advising people against buying it is still the right thing to do.
I wouldn't advise gamers to buy one in general, but there's absolutely a market for them. See https://rog.asus.com/desktops/mini-pc/rog-nuc/ and the broader SFFPC subculture for evidence of that.
No. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neural_processing_unit
Does Baldur's Gate III count as a "modern 3D game" to you? Because that runs at perfectly acceptable frame rates on my Lenovo Legion Go, whose Z1 Extreme is definitely less powerful than this.
Like every somewhat modern game console.
Yeah, why would frame generation have anything to do with gaming...
Edit: typo
If integrated graphics counts as a "gaming PC" then every PC and laptop made in the past 15 years, including Chromebooks count as a "Gaming PC".
Yeah, why would an iGPU so beefy, it's in the same league as a GeForce 4060 be called a gaming GPU? OUTRAGEOUS!
Also, Unexposedhazard used the term "gaming device".
Point is, we have had comparable systems for years that you can buy for less money, and are actually repairable and upgradable. Here's one in a similar form factor (with a 4060) that was built a year ago: https://youtu.be/P2CUi9W2DI0
Actually, it's not a point to the part I've replied to. The statement was solely that this APU-using PC must not be called a gaming device and I've pointed out the flaw in that claim. I did not make a comment regarding upgadability.
It's extremely gaming-capable and it is a PC. You can argue it's not in the traditional mould of gaming PC's if you want, but it's by any reasonable definition a "Gaming PC".
So, by that metric, the Steam Deck, Lenovo Legion Go and ROG Ally are laptops I guess.
Yeah I am a huge Framework fan (have one of their laptops and love it) but I at first had a hard time figuring out who this was for. Some other people in this thread have had some good comments about it, but for me personally this is completely useless.
It's for me. I guess since I pre-ordered. Why because I want to mess with llms in it and the 96 gigs of vram seem nice.
As one of the people with a different viewpoint that is a completely fair and sensible take.