this post was submitted on 18 Nov 2024
483 points (93.2% liked)

TenForward: Where Every Vulcan Knows Your Name

3872 readers
1374 users here now

/c/TenFoward: Your home-away-from-home for all things Star Trek!

Re-route power to the shields, emit a tachyon pulse through the deflector, and post all the nonsense you want. Within reason of course.

~ 1. No bigotry. This is a Star Trek community. Remember that diversity and coexistence are Star Trek values. Any post/comments that are racist, anti-LGBT, or generally "othering" of a group will result in removal/ban.

~ 2. Keep it civil. Disagreements will happen both on lore and preferences. That's okay! Just don't let it make you forget that the person you are talking to is also a person.

~ 3. Use spoiler tags. This applies to any episodes that have dropped within 3 months prior of your posting. After that it's free game.

~ 4. Keep it Trek related. This one is kind of a gimme but keep as on topic as possible.

~ 5. Keep posts to a limit. We all love Star Trek stuff but 3-4 posts in an hour is plenty enough.

~ 6. Try to not repost. Mistakes happen, we get it! But try to not repost anything from within the past 1-2 months.

~ 7. No General AI Art. Posts of simple AI art do not 'inspire jamaharon'

~ 8. No Political Upheaval. Political commentary is allowed, but please keep discussions civil. Read here for our community's expectations.

Fun will now commence.


Sister Communities:

[email protected]

[email protected]

[email protected]

[email protected]

Want your community to be added to the sidebar? Just ask one of our mods!


Honorary Badbitch:

@[email protected] for realizing that the line used to be "want to be added to the sidebar?" and capitalized on it. Congratulations and welcome to the sidebar. Stamets is both ashamed and proud.


Creator Resources:

Looking for a Star Trek screencap? (TrekCore)

Looking for the right Star Trek typeface/font for your meme? (Thank you @kellyaster for putting this together!)


founded 11 months ago
MODERATORS
 
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] kemsat 45 points 1 month ago (3 children)

Why wouldn’t you cure things at birth if you already know how to? Like, you know the kid is going to be blind, and you could just give the mom a shot to change that, but you’re gonna choose to let the kid be born blind? I dunno, that’s kinda messed up.

[–] Stamets 8 points 1 month ago

Which is one of the arguments against the Federations ban on genetic manipulation. There are plenty of others against it. There's no one answer to this situation, unfortunately.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 4 weeks ago (1 children)

You could make the same argument about down syndrome, autism, being transgender, darker skin tone. Eugenics is not a good thing, it seems appealing at first but it's a slippery slope and gets ugly very fast. Also they have the technology to accommodate these kinds of disabilities, so why bother with all that when he could get ocular implants and live a relatively normal life.

[–] kemsat 1 points 4 weeks ago

You’re absolutely right about the examples you mentioned. I still would rather not live, or have lived, than being blind or being born without an arm or something not whole or complete. So I would definitely prevent certain things from being experienced by my children if I had the option.

[–] [email protected] -3 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Because blindness isn't a disability in the Federation. Geordi lives a full and happy life, and, as OP mentioned, is actually able to save the entire crew specifically because he's blind.

"Fixing" his blindness in a compassionate, post-scarcity world that has the tools to allow someone to succeed no matter what physical characteristics they possess is like "fixing" a baby's hair color. It doesn't make the child's life easier, so what's the point other than eugenics?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 month ago (1 children)

The Federation is inherently plural, and we see several different attitudes toward disability by different people throughout the series.

Geordi is blind from birth. No one holds it against the guy. He wears a prosthetic vision device called a VISOR which is kind of the vision equivalent of a modern cochlear implant, there's an implant in his brain that an external sensor device hooks to. It's not a perfect solution, it gives him headaches, but it allows him to see and function like a sighted person, he can even see outside of the visual spectrum. Several times throughout the series we see him working with his doctor to maintain and adjust his implant when it gives him problems. Several times we see glimpses of possible futures where he has swapped his VISOR for alternative treatment methods, and the canonical future seen in the films has him using implants in his eyes, or even seeing with natural eyes because of that one fountain of youth planet. Throughout the show, people mention other treatments he could be using, but for the run of TNG he prefers his VISOR, which his doctor provides continuous care for. We see him go to Dr. Crusher to have his VISOR worked on repeatedly throughout the show.

Worf was paralyzed in an accident once. A heavy thing fell on him and broke his spine. Klingon culture is extremely ablest and he struggles to stand being seen by his friends or family in this condition, he wants to kill himself rather than live like this. He begrudgingly allows the doctors to try a treatment but quickly deems it unacceptable, so they INVENT SPINAL CORD REPLACEMENT SURGERY for him so that he can continue living his life on his terms. "There's nothing for it, we're just gonna have to grow a new backbone and central nervous system for the man."

Riva, the mediator/diplomat from the episode "Loud as a Whisper," is deaf. In his words, "Born, and hope to die." He has no intention of having his deafness cured or worked around, viewing it as a trait of his noble family and as a practical asset. He usually communicates through a trio of translators, but when they are killed, instead of attempting to cure his deafness via technology or medicine, Picard says "Okay it's time for US to learn sign language so we can talk to this man." and Data picks it up the fastest and takes on the role of interpreter. Riva's mission is to bring two warring factions to the negotiating table, so he decides to use sign language as an exercise in learning to communicate with each other. Fun fact: The actor who played Riva is deaf in real life. He asked the producers of Star Trek to make an episode about deaf people and had a lot of creative input on the episode.

===

If there is a through-line to how the Federation treats people with disabilities, it is to prioritize the patient's decisions. Geordi receives continuous care for his prosthetic vision. They fly in civilization's leading expert to do an experimental surgery on Worf. The conversation with Riva goes "We can-" "No thank you." "Okay."

As for this:

| Geordi...is actually able to save the entire crew specifically because he’s blind.

As Data points out in A Measure of a Man, though it would measurably improve a crewmember's ability to function because he could see a wider range of the EM spectrum, the Federation does not force members of Starfleet to replace their natural eyes with cybernetic implants.

This is also set in a universe full of sentient aliens with all different kinds of physical abilities and senses. Several species are empathic or telepathic able to sense and/or transmit their own emotions and thoughts. No humans can do that. Again in Measure of a Man, Picard hand waves off a demonstration of Data bending an unbendable girder because "Several sentient alien species possess mega strength." There's one episode with aliens that have a kind of solar powered heat ray thing (the plot required the aliens to be able to take hostages and they needed a weapon that Lt. Yar couldn't confiscate). In a society made up of multiple sentient species that evolved with vastly different physical abilities, I think your whole concept of "handicapped" or "disabled" needs to shift.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 month ago

The core theme is that the Federation provides individuals with agency over their bodies. Sure, Geordi's mother could have had his blindness cured before he would have known anything different, but it's his body and ultimately his choice. Interestingly, we see the opposite with Dr. Bashir. His genetic enhancements don't just offend the Federation because of historical trauma with the Eugenics Wars but because his parents didn't even give him choice in the matter (at least, that's how I've interpreted it).

[–] I_Has_A_Hat 8 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

In the episodes of TNG that look at their near future, Geordi has his eyes fixed, or at least has realistic implants that allow him to see normally. Why would he do it if there's no point? Is he stupid?

[–] Smoogs 7 points 1 month ago (1 children)

save the entire crew specifically because he’s blind

so you take away a persons autonomy to have the potential to be able to see and live a life with natural sight as you see a use for it.

You did a 360 there on the ethics and wandered into utilitarian territory reducing people to things.

You might not define it as a disability but it’s still taking autonomy from someone. They could just as well invent a tool to help save the crew. There is more than one option for things such as that rather than reducing a persons entire definition to their difference and how useful it is to you.

Human condition is more than their differences or their use to you.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I think he was getting at that Geordi's decision to remain blind and accommodated with his VISOR ended up having unforeseen positive consequences. In other words, pluralism leads to unforeseen positive side effects.

[–] Smoogs 1 points 1 month ago

Your use of pluralism here: Romanticizing taking away someone’s choice to be without a disability (or pain given his repeated conversations with doctors) doesn’t make this more palatable. Geordie hadn’t chosen to be blind it was a birth defect. He only gained power to see as a story point in a few episodes. The one time Pulaski did offer it it was clear from Geordie’s response that it isn’t a common known procedure to restore eyesight. Let alone a light one as it was irreversible. Given those parameters: Geordie hesitated because of the “lesser of known evils”.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

A major Geordi character arc revolves around his eyesight. Yes, his prosthesis affords him additional abilities and allows him full function, but that says nothing of the otherness he has felt and psychological impact of being different throughout his whole childhood, and the challenges he faced for acceptance, even within StarFleet.

To dismiss his personal struggles while assuming that he's fulfilled and would OPT to not have regular eyes is incredibly arrogant and ablest, no? It is also deeply lacking in awareness and consideration of psychology, which is pretty bang-on for Boomers of the era that STTNG came out. "Oh, well looking at the END RESULT, he turned out fine, despite his massive trauma."

The likelihood is that he did not turn out fine, we just don't see the granular details of his psyche, on screen.