399
this post was submitted on 22 Jun 2024
399 points (96.3% liked)
Political Memes
5520 readers
2231 users here now
Welcome to politcal memes!
These are our rules:
Be civil
Jokes are okay, but don’t intentionally harass or disturb any member of our community. Sexism, racism and bigotry are not allowed. Good faith argumentation only. No posts discouraging people to vote or shaming people for voting.
No misinformation
Don’t post any intentional misinformation. When asked by mods, provide sources for any claims you make.
Posts should be memes
Random pictures do not qualify as memes. Relevance to politics is required.
No bots, spam or self-promotion
Follow instance rules, ask for your bot to be allowed on this community.
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Uh. Madisonian Democracy is the division of powers between the three branches of government: Executive, Legislative, Judiciary.
Each one is a check against the other and a guard post against dictatorship. It's a brilliant system and not the...whatever bullshit you threw out there.
Oh yes what a brilliant system that can be blown apart by the president just deciding they have unchecked power now. Where any mechanism of accountability is either captured or so far beyond the realm of possibility that even one of the most bipartisan major votes I have seen in my lifetime failed to remove from office the most obviously criminal person to hold the office of president.
Your brilliant system relies entirely on the people inside it wanting it to continue working, and nothing about that is brilliant except the amount of almost willing lack of foresight it would take to not account for participants willingly attempting to sabotage and stop it up from within.
Not to mention how separating the executive from the legislative is itself a terrible idea that is no good and bad and stupid and dumb and Madison should have fucking known better, the independent executive is an inherent threat to democracy, it inherently aches against the limitations placed against it by the legislature, and inherently seeks ways to leech powers away from the legislature.
The true order of divisions should be State, Government, and Justice.
The State should be comprised of a greatly expanded Senate headed by a States' Tribune elected from their ranks and accountable to them charged with the duties of calling votes to invoke vetoes, calling votes to issue pardons, and performing the other functions of the head of state.
The Government should be headed by an even greaterly expanded house with the departments of the executive staffed by leaders elected from Congress as well as a Consul elected from their ranks and accountable to them. They perform the main body of the work of passing legislation, but can veto senate actions as much as the senate can veto theirs, and are the upper house because fuck anyone who puts the people's representatives below the house of dirt.
The judiciary needs to be a legal monkhood of judges who are pulled for cases with federal jurisdiction at random, and that can't pull any of that marbury v madison shit where they just decide they have new powers now either. The "Chief Justice" will be the senior most judge pulled for a case, and thr junior most will serve as the foreman of the bench of "jurors."
That's how you build a government that can keep operating even with active fuckery afoot, make it big, big to the point that attempts to mess with it can't be realized at scale anymore, make the responsibilities and duties clear and concrete, and for the love of god create means of accountability that are actually able to get used when someone still manages to fuck around so spectacularly that it warrants an immediate finding out.
None of this impeachment shit where the other side being more popular than a literal pile of horse shit means they can block any and all accountability. Still have that in there, but also have lesser accountability measures that don't take a political act of god to slap down on a judge literally caught taking bribes, or a national leader literally trying to send a lynch mob after his political rivals.
Nothing is perfect, and the American system relies on
A) an educated population (that's why education is first thing on the chopping block in republican budgets)
B) representatives in office who adhere to their oaths to protect the constitution. (We have a party currently seeking to end representative democracy and billionaires that have worked for 40 plus years to errode it to the point its gotten to)
In theory, it's one of the best forms of governance ever created. It's one weakness relies on the majority to "do the right thing." Unfortunately, the republican party has done so much damage over time it's going to take a long time to fix. Will the American population be able to understand that? Guess we will see.
340 million souls and an arsenal of nuclear arms warrants a more critical examination of what went wrong than "guess we'll see."
You just tried to rephrase exactly what I said was the problem as if it's some noble flaw, no, being designed to rely on everyone acting in good faith is stupidity and naivete at its most blatant.
Not even because I'm a cynic who believes people are inherently self interested or whatever the fuck, because they act self interestedly often enough that building a major government system around presumption of good faith is a sign that you are a complete moron who doesn't understand how anything actually works.
Madisonian Democracy was based on the teachings of Montesquieu, a French judge and creator of the Separation of Powers theory