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Hezbollah and Hamas flags waved during pro-Palestinian demonstration in New York
(today.lorientlejour.com)
this post was submitted on 13 Jun 2024
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But but people here told me they’re just freedom fighters!
They're not "just" freedom fighters: they ARE freedom fighters, but they are also conservative religious freedom fighters who utilize indiscriminate violence to advance their cause of by any means necessary.
They are not morally upright heroes. I can't support what they did. They are, however, also still freedom fighters. And it makes me very, very angry that their tactics have been successful after non-violence failed in 2018. It shouldn't have come to this.
As Kennedy astutely observed, “Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable”.
I cannot endorse the violence Hamas employs, but I also understand in such a context why others do. This was an inevitable outcome of extreme political disenfranchisement, and that makes me equally furious at the joint responsibility I see for the atrocities that have resulted.
That was well put, I don't know why all the downvotes?
I didn't downvote, but I would argue that you can't call someone a freedom fighter if their ideology or political position fundamentally opposes freedom, just because they are fighting for the cause of one particular oppressed group. To put a comparison: some Ukrainians that fought against the Soviet Union during WWII could have seen themselves as freedom fighters who were fighting for the right of self-determination of their nation (as they were fighting a dictatorship, and that was probably their main intention), but you absolutely cannot call yourself a freedom fighter when you're helping the nazis occupy half of Europe.
Banderites were fascists and contributed to plenty of massacres but they also fought the Nazis because they didn't feel like bending the knee to Hitler, unlike, say, the Ustaša. In that sense they weren't collaborationists. It's why the whole national hero emotionality surrounding Bandera gets so frustratingly complicated.
Makhno is a much more suitable national hero but he was on nobody's mind as the very idea or existence of Anarchism was suppressed in the USSR while Bandera was a suitable boogeyman. "Enemy of my oppressor is my hero" kind of mechanism.
Still, I hope my metaphor went across.
Ok, fair enough
What do you think freedom fighters are? The fact that they are fighting for freedom does not inherently mean that they support Western values. The West does not have a monopoly on freedom.
I guess its because freedom fighter has some sort of positive connotation to many. They may be fighting for freedom, but they're also just terrorists
Fighting for the freedom to subjugate people to their will instead of someone else's.
Yeah, not really a group of "freedom fighters" you'd expect people in the West to rally behind... yet here we are. Holding terrorists' flags in NYC lol
TIL: A bunch of flags at a rally is just as good as military support from western allies!
I guess I was more pointing toward the dark irony of waving terrorist flags in NYC
Who told you that?
Literally just yesterday, someone responded to a comment of mine about the peace deal “there is a genocide going on, they’re just freedom fighters” in reference to Hamas. LMAO
So one person?
Oh its a common sentiment on this site - that wasn't the first, or second, or third, time someone has said something similar. There's a common thing here where people look at a losing side and think it's a cause worthy of their support
I would say that the common sentiment is that Hamas and Hezbollah are terrorist organizations, but that doesn't justify killing Palestinians indiscriminately.
How long is your instance blocklist that this one left as a common sentiment?
Are you seriously saying people being pro-Hamas is far greater than people just being against the killing of innocent people?
Hard to tell, the latter ones are usually eerily quite or will deflect when pressed about the first one.
Usually? How often? Let's see your data. Or is this anecdotal?