efstajas

So what does it say about us diverting from purely server-side scripted message boards with pure HTML and tables, and not a line of JS? Yes, let's get back there please.

Ironically, proper SSR that has the server render the page as pure HTML & CSS is becoming more and more popular lately thanks to full-stack meta frameworks that make it super easy. Of course, wanting to go back to having no JS is crazy — websites would lose almost all ability to make pages interactive, and that would be a huge step backwards, no matter how much nostalgia you feel for a time before widespread JS. Also tables for layout fucking sucked in every possible way; for the dev, for the user, and for accessibility.

people want nice, dynamic, usable websites with lots of cool new features, people are social

That's right, they do and they are.

By the way, we already had that with Flash and Java applets, some things of what I remember were still cooler than modern websites of the "web application" paradigm are now.

Flash and Java Applets were a disaster and a horrible attempt at interactivity, and everything we have today is miles ahead of them. I don't even want to get into making arguments as to why because it's so widely documented.

And we had personal webpages with real names and contacts and photos. And there were tools allowing to make them easily.

There are vastly more usable and simple tools for making your own personal websites today!

Holy shit go touch some grass. Jesus Christ

So you're talking about SaaS / business tooling then? Again though, that's just one of many segments of software, which was my point.

Also, even in that market it's just not true to say that there's no incentive for it to work well. If some new business tool gets deployed and the workforce has problems with it to the point of measurable inefficiency, of course that can lead to a different tool being chosen. It's even pretty common practice for large companies to reach out to previous users of a given product through consultancy networks or whatever to assess viability before committing to anything.

I think it's mostly just that phones by themselves absolutely suck as a form factor for pretty much everything but casual games.

Hillary: robots must follow the three laws of robotics

Bernie: robots can have a little evil

Then we're very far away from the 21st century though.

I don't really get this point. Of course there's a financial motive for a lot of software to work well. There are many niches of software that are competitive, so there's a very clear incentive to make your product work better than the competition.

Of course there are cases in which there's a de-facto monopoly or customers are locked in to a particular offering for whatever reason, but it's not like that applies to all software.

Absolutely not, time doesn't give a shit about humans, and would happily pass without any conscious observer at all anywhere in the universe.

Doing that would tell you nothing about whether the browser might have un-patched, known vulnerabilities elsewhere.

How do you know this? Of course there are lots of reasons for why they'd want to enforce minimum browser versions. But security might very well be one of them. Especially if you're a bank you probably feel bad about sending session tokens to a browser that potentially has known security vulnerabilities.

And sure, the user agent isn't a sure way to tell whether a browser is outdated, but in 95% of cases it's good enough, and people that know enough to understand the block shouldn't apply to them can bypass it easily anyway.

I gotta say mRNA vaccines. It's not technically a 21st century invention, but much of the work to make them viable started in the early 2000s. The speed at which the COVID vaccine got developed and widely deployed was honestly incredible and a massive W for humanity. I remember thinking a vaccine would be years away.

There's no reason your clients can't have public, world routeable IPs as well as security.

There are a lot of valid reasons, other than security, for why you wouldn't want that though. You don't necessarily want to allow any client's activity to be traceable on an individual level, nor do you want to allow people to do things like count the number of clients at a particular location. Information like that is just unnecessary to expose, even if hiding it doesn't make anything more secure per se.