this post was submitted on 14 Dec 2023
-29 points (14.6% liked)

Conservative

408 readers
140 users here now

A place to discuss pro-conservative stuff

  1. Be excellent to each other. Civility, No Racism, No Bigotry, No Slurs, No calls to violences, No namecalling, All that good stuff, follow lemm.ee's rules, follow the rules of your instance, etc.

  2. We are a Pro-Conservative forum. Posts must have a clear pro-conservative, or anti left-wing bias. We are interested in promoting conservatism and discussing things that might get ignored elsewhere. All sources are acceptable, however reputable sources with a reputation for factual reporting are preferred.

  3. Dissent is allowed in the comments, but try to be constructive; if you do not agree, then provide a reason which is backed up by references or a reasonable alternative interpretation of the provided facts. That means the left wing is welcome to state their opinions, but please keep it in good faith.

A polite request, not a rule, if you feel the need to report a comment, please don't reply to it.

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
 

This has been a hot topic for conservatives. I fully support Ukraine, but at some point, they have to say they can't push Russia out. Ukraine does not have the manpower or firepower to dislodge Russia. They've tried and failed. Western support is starting to go down because they have not made progress.

I don't know the solution, but right now, it's just a war of attrition, and Ukraine loses in that scenario. I suspect this will be a big topic of discussion during the presidential debates.

top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] Transcendant 20 points 1 year ago (28 children)

They haven't failed. They need advanced firepower and continued support. Putin from the start is relying on you lot sticking a spoke in the gears, and unsurprisingly conservatives are lining up to do his bidding.

You have a golden opportunity to boost US businesses (most Ukraine aid never leaves the US); hammer a rival, hostile nation; and prevent further encroachment on your allies. Further, all this comes at zero cost of US lives.

Or you could let Putin win.

[–] [email protected] -3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Conservatives are sabotaging Ukraine's efforts by not giving them every thing they need right now? That is a very entitled attitude.

The question is how much does funding a proxy war against Russia help the US. For some the bemifits have outweighed the costs, for others it is a holy crusade and no cost is too great.

[–] [email protected] -5 points 1 year ago

I fully support Ukraine, but at some point, you have to say they are up shit creek. They lost the counter-offensive, we can't keep up with their demand for ammunition. If they keep at this rate, they will collapse. If China were to invade Taiwan or North Korea to invade South Korea, we wouldn't be able to put up a solid defense since we have given away so much ammo.

https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2023-03-29/milley-us-has-long-way-to-go-to-build-munitions-stockpile

load more comments (27 replies)
[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Republicans have to be mad at Ukraine and pro-Russia because Trump is mad at Ukraine and pro-Russia. Anyone who doesn't sincerely express the same sentiments as dear leader Trump risks ostracization. The party of free-thinking rugged individualists. Of course, liberals have the same failing to some degree.

I think there could be a lot more international pressure brought to bear on Russia. That alone added to the current situation would not be enough to save Ukraine, but I can imagine scenarios in which Russia decides it's not worth it to continue.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I think the Republican leadership is mainly going against Ukraine to spite the Democrats. Most Republicans I know (not leadership) support Ukraine, at least to some extent.

I am the strongest supporter I know but I won't support American troops on the ground. I also won't support our most advanced weapons going to Ukraine but luckily that hasn't even been suggested.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Republican leaders are against something you personally support, and you feel they take that position just to spite the democrats huh? So attacking a sovereign nation and various war crimes (deliberately targeting civilians, rape, torture, bombing a children's and maternity hospital, etc, etc) are less important to them than sticking it to the democrats? Am I understanding this correctly?

[–] [email protected] -4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

It’s my pet theory. Name another war republicans haven’t wanted to fight? I can’t think of any. They didn’t seem to mind when Trump started to send them lethal weapons. They only cared when Biden did.

And don’t act so pious. Democrats have openly done the same with Israel. Hamas did the same things as Russia. Yet democrats are defending them like crazy.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

It is because of my piety that the whole thing seems sus. Israel has a right to defend itself but somehow Ukraine doesn't. I remember prophets in the Bible pointing out that Israel had become unrighteous, corrupt and wayward, but now ppl act like it is impossible for Israel to do any wrong. Hamas is a group of horrible terrorists, ( yes they are horrible terrorists) but Putin's invasion of Ukraine is "genius" and "savvy" according to Trump.

I'm just over here praying for peace.

[–] [email protected] -3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Ukraine does as well. Im not sure where you’re getting they don’t

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I'm referring to the article you posted, and to the many republicans that clearly don't feel that the defence of freedom and democracy, nor the existence of Ukraine and the Ukrainian people are important. If they did, they wouldn't use aid as a bargaining chip in an attempt get extremist border policies passed.

[–] [email protected] -3 points 1 year ago

Nothing extreme about protecting your border. You seem to think we must ignore our border and pay for the defense of Ukraine.

The only obligation we have is to keep our country safe.

[–] roofuskit 6 points 1 year ago (7 children)

First let's give them all of JD Vance's property and maybe his kids and then let's see if that ends the war.

load more comments (7 replies)