this post was submitted on 07 Mar 2024

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[Rant] A few days ago, I asked if Mint would run okay on a Lenovo T460 (I appreciate all the advice). I got it working, but the installation was a big pain and I totally blame Lenovo. (self.linux)

submitted 6 months ago by FlyingSquid to c/[email protected]

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I got the T460 refurbished and I really didn't want to run Windows 10 on it. I last used Linux for any real length of time a good 20 years ago, so I'm pretty inexperienced with it at this point and I had to figure out how to install it myself.

They made it unreasonably difficult to first install an OS from a USB stick. I had to go into the BIOS, turn UEFI to legacy, turn off secure boot, reboot to boot from the USB stick, install Mint, then turn legacy back to UEFI to get it to boot from the hard drive. This took about 2 hours of trying to figure it out by doing a lot of forums reading.

I do not blame the Mint community or the Linux community as a whole. There is absolutely no reason that it should have been that hard to install Mint on that notebook.

I don't even think getting into the BIOS once time should be necessary, but changing a BIOS setting so you can install the OS and changing it back so you can run the OS off the internal drive is just ridiculous and I find it hard to believe Lenovo couldn't have just made it easier. I'm fairly convinced this was intentional on their part.

I'm not an IT professional or anything, but I know enough to figure this stuff out with effort, but it shouldn't have taken that effort. It should have been almost plug-and-play. This is 2024. The notebook isn't even 10 years old.

Is there actually a good reason for this or are they just kissing Microsoft's ass?

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[–] danielfgom 2 points 6 months ago

I totally agree. I am an IT Profe and it's still very irritating to have to jump through these hoops. Plus each manufacturer has a different key you need to press to access the bios. Sometimes the same OEM will have different keys on different models.

So you try the normal ones which don't work and then have to Google the model number to try find out which key to hold.

Frustrating and time consuming. And definitely makes it very difficult for the average user to install Linux.

I sometimes think Microsoft did it on purpose to hinder Linux installs and then disguised it as "security".

It's not really "security" if you can turn it off is it?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 months ago (1 children)

99% of people buy those to run Windows on. From Lenovo's point of view it's working great.

[–] FlyingSquid 1 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Probably. I'm guessing Microsoft is also giving them money.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Other way around... the hardware is largely useless to most consumers without Windows so Lenovo is paying for that integration.

[–] FlyingSquid 1 points 6 months ago (1 children)

They have to pay for integration? I'm surprised Microsoft wouldn't just let any hardware maker do that so they can run Windows regardless. I would think that would be in their best interest since they seem mostly to be interested in selling subscription services these days.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 months ago

Lenovo is a customer of Microsoft, not the other way around. Microsoft isn't paying for the "privilege" to be on Lenovo hardware.

[–] TCB13 -3 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (5 children)

That's what you get when you buy Lenovo. It can't even run Windows properly most of the time how did you expect it to run Linux?

Seriously if you go into any large company and ask why they don't use Lenovo they'll simply tell you that the failure rate of those machines is way to high to be worth it. Like order 50 and only 10 are in working condition after 2 years... or a simple USB 3 cable running along the computer will make it slow because there isn't enough shielding on the machine and the high frequency of those cables interferes with your storage controller / NVMe.

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[–] [email protected] -3 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (1 children)

are they just kissing Microsoft's ass?

This. 100%. It's why I don't understand folks recommending Lenovo laptops to run Linux on. Lenovo is in bed well Microsoft and caters to whatever they want. SecureBoot, modern standby, etc. We need more vendors supporting open source firmware like Coreboot.

Edit: feel free to refute me instead of just down voting.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 6 months ago

Lenovo also no longer deserves their reputation for durability. They haven't for at least a decade. Their usb-c charging ports wear out super fast

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