this post was submitted on 11 Dec 2023
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Climate - truthful information about climate, related activism and politics.

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Discussion of climate, how it is changing, activism around that, the politics, and the energy systems change we need in order to stabilize things.

As a starting point, the burning of fossil fuels, and to a lesser extent deforestation and release of methane are responsible for the warming in recent decades: Graph of temperature as observed with significant warming, and simulated without added greenhouse gases and other anthropogentic changes, which shows no significant warming

How much each change to the atmosphere has warmed the world: IPCC AR6 Figure 2 - Thee bar charts: first chart: how much each gas has warmed the world.  About 1C of total warming.  Second chart:  about 1.5C of total warming from well-mixed greenhouse gases, offset by 0.4C of cooling from aerosols and negligible influence from changes to solar output, volcanoes, and internal variability.  Third chart: about 1.25C of warming from CO2, 0.5C from methane, and a bunch more in small quantities from other gases.  About 0.5C of cooling with large error bars from SO2.

Recommended actions to cut greenhouse gas emissions in the near future:

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[–] DarkMessiah 26 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

Kinda wish they were bragging. Might trigger the US’ competitive streak and we’d be down two major polluters rather than one.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 year ago

I'd love to see a competitive effort at who can decarbonize faster.

[–] rockSlayer 15 points 1 year ago (1 children)

A large part of the pollution coming from the US is due to the military. Given the approach the US used in the last cold war, I feel like this country would immediately turn to fossil-fascism

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

You got a source for that? Quick googling subjects the military emits about as much as Denmark, which would make it 0.6% of overall US emissions. I wouldn't call that a large portion.

https://insideclimatenews.org/news/18012022/military-carbon-emissions/ https://wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_dioxide_emissions

[–] rockSlayer 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

From your own source, the military has been extensively underreporting their emissions for as long as they've been keeping track. There's also the fact that they don't even try to research into the wider military industrial complex, simply because that would be a nearly impossible task. You're going off the title of "more than Denmark", right? This source did the math in reverse. If it were a country, it would be 47th in the world. To say that it isn't a massive polluter in it's own right is either completely disingenuous or outright lying.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I'm not saying military ghg emissions aren't huge, but it's not a large part of overall US emissions. With the 59 million tones from your source, that means it accounts for about 1.2% of emissions. That's not small, but it more speaks to just how huge the US's overall emissions are.

[–] rockSlayer 6 points 1 year ago

Oh, I see now. I was simply stating "it's a huge polluter", and that got interpreted as a large percentage of emissions. It's a fair interpretation based on my wording though. The real winners are the people that now have multiple sources for the environmental harm caused by the military

[–] DarthFrodo 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

There's no way they would do that since climate change is a "tradegy of the commons" problem.

The tragedy of the commons is a metaphoric label for a concept that is widely discussed in economics, ecology and other sciences. According to the concept, should a number of people enjoy unfettered access to a finite, valuable resource such as a pasture, they will tend to over-use it, and may end up destroying its value altogether. To exercise voluntary restraint is not a rational choice for individuals – if they did, the other users would merely supplant them – yet the predictable result is a tragedy for all.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons

Currently, every country seeks to maximize the emissions that they are still allowed to have without being penalized (internationally, and by their own population).

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The US landed men on the moon to show the Soviets who has the better technology. All countries have already agreed that climate change is not only a problem, but that emissions have to be lowered in the Paris Agreement. Soft power is real power, so a race towards zero emissions is entirly possible. Also there are other reasons for doing it too. Right now the US has a political disliking of Russia, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Venezuela and many other large oil producers. All of them would be weakend by the US lowering its own oil consumption too.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

Unfortunately, the US decided to go the other direction and become a major oil producer in the last twenty years for the very reason you mention.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

The tragedy of the commons is an oversimplified myth, debunked before it became popular. The miracle of the commons.