Cars - For Car Enthusiasts

3969 readers

32 users here now

About Community

c/Cars is the largest automotive enthusiast community on Lemmy and the fediverse. We're your central hub for vehicle-related discussion, industry news, reviews, projects, DIY guides, advice, stories, and more.

Rules

Stay respectful to the community, hold civil discussions, even when others hold opinions that may differ from yours.

This is not an NSFW community, and any such content will not be tolerated.

Policy, not politics! Policy discussions revolve around the concept; political discussions revolve around the individual, party, association, etc. We only allow POLICY discussions and political discussions should go to c/politics.

Must be related to cars, anything that does not have connection to cars will be considered spam/irrelevant and is subject to removal.

founded 2 years ago

MODERATORS

BallShapedMan

RightHandOfIkaros

Efficiency test of my 2024 Prius Prime: Gasoline vs Electricity in my first week. (self.cars)

submitted 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) by dragontamer to c/cars

26 comments fedilink hide all child comments

The Prius Prime is a dual fuel vehicle, able to run 100% on Electric, or 100% on gasoline, or a computerized blend in-between. This presents me a great opportunity to be able to do a direct comparison with the same car of an EV engine vs an ICE engine.

Toyota computer claims 3.2mi-per-kwhr.
Kill-a-watt (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kill_A_Watt) claims 2.2mi-per-kwhr.
Additional 1.5% losses should be assumed in the wires if you wish. (120V drops down to 118V during charging, meaning 2V of the energy was lost due to the resistance of my home's wires).
Level 1 charger at home (known to be less efficient).
Toyota computer claims 53miles-per-gallon (American Gallon).
I have not independently verified the gallon usage of my car.
295 miles driven total, sometimes EV, sometimes Gasoline, sometimes both.
30F to 40F (-1C to 4.5C) in my area this past week.
Winter-blend fuel.
12.5miles per $electricity-dollar (17.1c / kw-hr home charging costs)
17.1 miles per $gasoline-dollar ($3.10 per gallon last fillup).

If anyone has questions about my tests. The main takeaway is that L1 charging is so low in efficiency that gasoline in my area is cheaper than electricity. Obviously the price of gasoline and electricity varies significantly area-to-area, so feel free to use my numbers to calculate / simulate the costs in your area.

There is also substantial losses of efficiency due to cold weather, that is well acknowledged by the EV community. The Prius Prime (and most other EVs) will turn on a heater to keep the battery conditioned in the winter, spending precious electricity on battery-conditioning rather than miles. Gasoline engines do not have this problem and remain as efficient in the winter.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments

[–] surewhynotlem 5 points 3 days ago (1 children)

If you're going to add transmission loses, you should reduce the miles spent driving to the gas station from your driving distance to be fair. That's just overhead and not part of your use of the car.

You should also charge for your time going to the gas station and spent there.

[–] dragontamer -1 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (1 children)

Okay, so you want me to remove 0.25 miles from my 530 mile tank?

And you think that meaningfully changes the calculations... why? But sure, its a 529.75 mile gas tank (1/4th a mile out of my way between my work and house), for a difference of 0.05% less efficiency on the gasoline engine.

Any other effects you want me to throw on here? Or are you splitting hairs? But I think ~30% losses from the advertised ranges in the 30F / -1C temperatures for EVs is the main problem here that people probably should know about. And honestly, I'm not sure if 0.05% losses due to trips to the gas station are... relevant.

I've ignored the wire-loss (1.5% losses) in my house btw for the above calculations. But I have the ability to measure the 120V to 118V loss thanks to Kill-a-Watt. I bring this up because my coworker was getting 8V of loss (aka: 6% losses) when he was charging his Tesla. So wire losses might be substantial and the reader should be aware of how to actually measure wire losses.

[–] surewhynotlem 8 points 3 days ago (2 children)

Hey man, I'm just trying to make you more accurate. No need to get all fussy about it.

[–] davidagain 2 points 2 days ago

Dude genuinely sees flying off the handle as the right way of responding to disagreement. He explains that people who criticise him are iredeemably dishonest so debating them is a waste of time and he finds it ends the discussion much quicker if he puts a lot of anger and insults in.

Straight up!

https://lemmy.world/comment/13878703

I'll paste it on case he deletes it.

You want them to take it back. Do so.e research, and prove them wrong. Otherwise, stop shouting.

BTW: Seriously, you seem naive to me so let me give you a serious protip.

If someone thinks you are biased on the internet, and you owe them nothing (not like a close friend or a family or something), you STOP TALKING WITH THEM BECAUSE ITS A WASTE OF TIME. And I’ve found that shouting, and direct insults, is the fastest way to make it clear that I’m ending the discussion.

Again: don’t waste your time trying to prove yourself against baseless accusations on internet. Its not worth the hassle. If you find yourself doing that, you are the one who will get stressed out in the long term.

So I reject your advice and instead replace it with the exact opposite. Get angry. Shout, end the discussion. Then move on with your life. The discussion has been blown up, so its easier to move on. Don’t lol “do research” on behalf of other people who don’t give two shits about you and drag on the unnecessary discussion for days. They never were going to believe you anyway, because they thought you were biased from the start.

He lives by the anger and insults advice, I can attest, but in terms of ending the discussion, and moving on with his life, he's not so good at that part. I believe him when he claims to refuse to do any balancing tests, but not for the reasons he claims, he just doesn't want to know about data that paints a different picture.

[–] dragontamer -5 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

I'm just trying to point out that you made an irrelevant comment. No need to get fussy about it. Maybe think a bit before posting next time, lol.

Not all factoids are relevant to a discussion. Especially the things that are only fractions of a percent difference.