this post was submitted on 14 Jul 2023
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70 people admit they should be investigated for high treason
How is it treasonous to cut support for a foreign country, exactly?
The treason part is getting paid for their votes by Russia
Please don't parrot incorrect statements without bothering to read the rest of the thread from a position of arrogant ignorance. This claim has been repeated over and over yet not a single person has bothered to back it with any actual law. It's not in the constitution, if that's what you think.
It's in the Constitution of Ukraine
https://zakon.rada.gov.ua/laws/show/1647-14
Huh, interesting. They can get tried when the USA gets annexed by Ukraine then.
I responded to the wrong comment, I thought this was the thread about elections in Ukraine, haha. I deleted it, but deletions don't propagate between servers quickly
rude
Russia is Ukraine's enemy not yours, unless you ascribe to seeing this as a proxy war. That's like saying pulling out of Afghanistan was treason because it concedes to Taliban's victory.
Bro Russia media and politicians are constantly talking about nuking my country. And Russia has attacked it with both cyber attacks and information warfare over and over.
But you knew that already, considering you probably consider yourself well informed.
Care to provide a source to all those nuke threats or should I roam the informational warzone on my own? And also explain how that would be one-sided Russian aggression rather than escalation between two great power as has been tradition for 70 years now? Even if what you say is true, mere threats of warfare don't equate to training terrorists and backing Al-Qaeda, which the Taliban is known to have done. Those were literally United Stadia's enemies, one of which even did a successful attack on USA soil that killed 3 thousand, as you'll never forget. If not financing a foreign country's war with Russia is treason, then everybody (in and out of government) who advocated for pulling out of Afghanistan should be tried first. Obviously I don't believe that either of those actually are treason, just pointing out how nonsensical this notion is.
"Cyber attacks" and "information warfare" are just hyperbolic terms for things every non-allied powerful country engages in. Even allies like the USA and EU spy on each other.
So you are just admitting to being uninformed. Excellent.
So you admitted your sources are made of thin air. Excellent. Back your claims buddy, I never claimed to know every single thing every European does to themselves. What is your opinion on the FRG9, Sir Knowsalot?
There are tons of videos of Russian media unironically calling to nuke Europe. They even released CGI videos of New York being nuked. I can't follow the news for you buddy.
links or sources? "There are tons of videos of" Obama playing Fortnite with Trump. This is a forum about news discussions so if you're expecting anybody to come here and not ask for news and sources backing your claims and to trust what you say blindly, you might be a bit lost.
Crazy how you seem to get two instant votes here
No idea about that either, maybe I have a fan. I don't see how a single meaningless upvote is that important though. But it's also crazy how you insist on replying within minutes without backing your claims. Have you anything to say that is not just hearsay?
I can't read for you, sealion. Try Google, if it isn't blocked in your country.
Oh, so you get to claim whatever on a news forum, but then when pressed I'm the one who actually has to find out what exactly you're even talking about? And in case I can't read your mind, I'm the sealion? How would I even know what events exactly you're even trying to mysteriously hint at? Come now, if you don't wish to show me wrong or inform literally anybody beyond vague hearsay what exactly even is the point of you posting here? This ain't Reddit mate.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning
Don't play dumb
But sure. Let's see how fast those goalposts move.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/russia-tv-jokes-nuclear-missiles-london-putin-propaganda-ukraine-war-rcna28067
I know what sealioning is. However the effort you took to fetch that bookmarked Wikipedia page you could've used to provide me some source for your nuclear threat claims for us to discuss and analyse properly as is typical of a news forum. Given that I'm actually putting a bit of time and effort to reply to you and that the point of this forum is to inform, assuming everybody who comes here has access to every information about whatever remote country you may live on and what specific threats you are referring to is just a waste of bandwidth and account and you might as well just remove yourself from here.
For instance, those threats could've come right after similar threats from your random country in which case it would be escalation (and you'd link me to the wikipedia article of Whataboutism rather than whatever source you find actually interesting, as you people like to do). I have no way of knowing what "constant" threats you are talking about because tensions between some American countries and Russia have been ongoing for more than 10 years now. So far you have made a very strong unsourced claim and then proceeded to waste this comment section by assuming random shit about me. If you don't have anything of substance to say, go back to Reddit to updoot your narwhals in silence.
Edit: fucking finally you provided it, too bad it was on an unmarked edit. Either way I'm not sure I'd consider something from the height of the war a whole year ago "constant", and the threat is being made by a TV show. In their own words "Moscow says it went into Ukraine as a pre-emptive strike against NATO, as Ukraine was seeking nuclear weapons.", so it would still fall into an escalation rather than a blanket threat. Typical thing done by opposing Nuclear Powers since nuclear bombs were invented.
It’s not the same as supporting pulling out of Afghanistan because Taliban is no threat to the US.
Russia is a global threat with its disinformation, blackmail and bribery campaigns that interfere with US and global politics. That makes it much more of a threat to the US than the Taliban.
(Still not treason though as the threat is not direct)
Edit: someone down thread says that selling votes to foreign governments is treason in the US. Sounds reasonable but I don’t know.
You're going to have to provide some source as to how much more threatening Russia is to the USA compared to Taliban, since the USA explicitly fought a war "of self defence" against those ones. Conceding defeat in a war on foreign land being considered "high treason" because you don't like it would make most freedomnian military adventures since the 60s very dubyous as well. Russia doing whatever it is you think they're doing still doesn't make them your explicit enemy until you actually declare on war on them, which even the most hawkish Democrat will caution against.
Virgin literal terrorist training Vs Chad news website and "bribery"
I doubt that is true and you shouldn't trust hearsay on the internet, but if that's the case then your whole lobbying industry should treasonous as well. You can go read the law to see that is not the case, but you'd have to be very naïve to think such law could even be applied properly in the USA anyways. Pre-empting your knee-jerk response, "giving them aid" does not apply to "stopping the giving of aid to the enemies of our enemies".
So you believe that Ukraine is a puppet state of the US?
What a shit take
The guy before me used the word treason. How do you interpret that?
As serving Russian interests, what kind of connection do they have to the Russian state if they so brazenly vote for the wishes of Putin?
That is a new definition of treason for me, but okay call it what you want.
Is a cooperation on space travel also treason?
That's a false equivalence, this isn't exactly cooperation towards a mutually beneficial goal, this is just trying to reduce support for a country which by sheer coincidence is an enemy of Putin.
It follows rather directly. For it to be high treason to be against sending more military resources to Ukraine would mean that either the representatives are members of the Ukrainian government or, as was implied here, that Ukraine is a puppet state.
It's not high treason against the USA to be against the USA sending military resources to another country. You can only commit high treason against your own country.
You're willfully dancing around the actual point OP is making. You can't be a grown adult and think this concretely without doing so in bad faith.
The point is that opposing this is directly showing support for Russia...
Which guess what: isn't high treason. If you'll notice, I havent offered my opinion here or participated elsewhere in the thread.
I was simply pointing out that using the term "high treason" here is rather silly and nonfactual.
It literally doesn't. RTFC.
Enemies there refers to during war in which the USA is not, and giving "Aid and Comfort" there means material aid and has literally no relation in the text to whether you receive something for such aid in return. By interpreting "giving them aid" as promoting foreign policy that helps a rival nation as "treason" using that text, you have to completely ignore the part about "bribes" and assume that it applies even in peacetime, which means that every foreign policy decision that helps a rival would be "treason". I'm sure the USA has some other backwards law that prevents lobbying but only if the lobbyist is not white or is a foreigner (and would be happy to have anybody who actually reads laws send it to me), but it is not in the text of the constitution and to claim it is is just either blatantly false or some Ouija-board-level spirit of the law shit. You should definitely read before you write.
So you aren't making any argument at all, and are just saying "everyone look at my bold linguistic castle. It is very cromulent."
Quit acting like the average Redditor, and just be civil and disagree.
Jesus Christ, not the kind of comment I'd expect from a pacifist. You come off real mature
What a psychotic statement.
Wow. Where the hell did you get that idea?
You say that US citizens (the republican politicians) who do not support Ukraine should be trialed for treason. This implies that Ukraine is a part of the US, doesn't it?
Womp womp go fuck yourself.
your name is pacifist but you support sending weapons of death and destruction into a conflict where they will be used to kill people? they're sending fucking clusterbombs dude what is it going to take to convince you people this is not a good thing?
Hey, Ukrainian here. Try to convince me that it's a bad thing. Russians shelling Ukrainian cities with cluster munitions is okay, but Ukraine fighting back is bad? Russia brought all the deaths and destruction, not Ukraine, or "the west".
Enjoy your clusterbombs
At least they have ~3% fail rate and will be used against military targets vs russian 30-40% fail rate and used in the cities