this post was submitted on 02 Jun 2024
1099 points (97.8% liked)

Political Memes

5491 readers
2694 users here now

Welcome to politcal memes!

These are our rules:

Be civilJokes are okay, but don’t intentionally harass or disturb any member of our community. Sexism, racism and bigotry are not allowed. Good faith argumentation only. No posts discouraging people to vote or shaming people for voting.

No misinformationDon’t post any intentional misinformation. When asked by mods, provide sources for any claims you make.

Posts should be memesRandom pictures do not qualify as memes. Relevance to politics is required.

No bots, spam or self-promotionFollow instance rules, ask for your bot to be allowed on this community.

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] iopq 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

You are totally correct, which is why libertarians define the function of government to be everything the market can't solve. It's the government's responsibility to provide for defense (nobody would voluntarily provide for everyone's defense) and to limit pollution (nobody would voluntarily decrease their own emissions)

Being 100% ideologically pure doesn't work in the real world. I would support something closer to the Fair Tax, because my own tax preparation wastes around 12 hours every year. If I got married, I'd pay a much much higher tax as well (maybe double!) I think there should be no marriage penalty for taxation. I almost don't hear people talk about this, but it's probably hurting birth rates in the US, which is already before replacement

[–] Aceticon 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Well, as I pointed out, Market can't solve things like Negative Externalities and Tragedy Of The Commons, nor can it do broad Strategy (for example, investing in Education to have a population which in aggregate is more productive) and those things are a lot more than merelly Defense and Polution (for example, Road Safety is a Negative Externality subject and reliable Product Information is a Tragedy Of The Commons one if you consider "trust in sellers" a form of Commons that if exhausted by too much abuse leads every buyer to make their purchase decisions from distrust-as-default, which is reduces trade).

As for lower birth rates, from my own country (Portugal) and having lived all over Europe, I would say the greatest present day problem is not at all taxes (as long as they're actually used to pay for Public Services such as Universal Healthcare, they tend to help the most those who earn the least, such as young adults beginning their careers) but rather house price inflation: people are living their parents' home later, marrying later, getting children later, getting fewer children (because they can't afford a bigger house or the cost of multiple children whilst paying for a bigger mortgage) and even in the case of some countries (like Portugal) leaving the country for places were houses are cheaper as a proportion of Income.

Taxes need to be used better (more in ways that benefit people in general, less as pork and to pay the jobs for "the boys" from the mainstream political parties) and the time-waste burdern of taxation needs to be minimized, but that's a completelly different position from a generic "taxes are bad" - I don't think it's taxes that are bad, I think it's the well entrenched politicians from certain political parties that are bad and hence when in power use taxes badly.

[–] iopq 1 points 5 months ago

Well, the market providing higher salaries to educated people does encourage parents to invest into education for their children. But the other two points we are in agreement about.

Road safety is also something the local government should take care of. I was specifically talking about federal government, of course local governments have a role as well. For example, making sure to persecute criminals. Providing courts for civil suits, etc. It is not clear that the market would provide solutions for these services.

What is not clear is that the postal service should be national since the market already has several private services. The government can contact you via the internet for official notifications and send your driver's license by UPS or Fedex.

So the libertarian position is that things that have good private solutions should not be duplicated by the government at the taxpayer's expense. The increased costs of things like sending mail will be offset by lower taxes. This is more fair as the people who send more mail will pay more.