this post was submitted on 02 Jun 2024
1099 points (97.8% liked)
Political Memes
5402 readers
4510 users here now
Welcome to politcal memes!
These are our rules:
Be civil
Jokes are okay, but don’t intentionally harass or disturb any member of our community. Sexism, racism and bigotry are not allowed. Good faith argumentation only. No posts discouraging people to vote or shaming people for voting.
No misinformation
Don’t post any intentional misinformation. When asked by mods, provide sources for any claims you make.
Posts should be memes
Random pictures do not qualify as memes. Relevance to politics is required.
No bots, spam or self-promotion
Follow instance rules, ask for your bot to be allowed on this community.
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
So, I emphasized trustless and decentralized in social organizations. "It just works for social media" isn't exactly addressing what I was getting at. For example, Lemmy has a bot account problem. All that freedom makes it harder to prevent that problem.
But if you're talking about how a government is a system of voting bodies that authorize some action given state (policy), and authority is delegated by some means - say, voting - then the botting problem of Lemmy is not just "something that doesn't work", it's a critical failure which would enable fraud.
So, when I brought up Sybil attacks, I was trying to avoid a long winded digression including arguments from Microsoft on Decentralized ID. But the point being, it can be decentralized. Policy is action given state but action is delegated to people inevitably. But when you vote, would you rather trust a person to count those votes or a trustless automated system?
I'm talking about you said you want to use tech "to make up for the inefficiencies of decentralized economics". It's not about making open source software that works. That's easy. The question is who controls the wires? We can already see where ISPs and countries can check everything passing through their system. What's to prevent someone from gaining control of a critical mass of physical nodes and blocking traffic from anyone who doesn't pay them a "fee"?
You're talking about the software but you're forgetting that it all runs on hardware somewhere in a windowless building. Even if you decentralize that, you've still got the problem of gatekeeping. How long before each node requires .1 pennies per packet? How good is long distance trade going to be when just making the offer costs a significant amount?
Again, those are my ideals. Realistically, not everything can be decentralized in a trustless way.
That said, much of our current system of signing documents to verify it was done by a certain Identity can be automated. Enforcement and neorealism are a separate issue to mitigate, but the delegation of authority to humans can be automated without human involvement
I think the ideals of anarchy left are great. But we should treat them more like classical liberals treated their, "state of nature". It wasn't a goal, it was a guiding metric. The progressives of the time theorized that humans are naturally good and that's why we can have democracies. That's a huge simplification but it's to make my point. Instead of actually trying for anarchy we should be trying to use and mold government to achieve outcomes.
For example anti-capitalism. If we tried to go into anarchy one of the biggest dangers is actually corporate feudalism. Where corporations become the default law. Instead we should be regulating corporations and making it clear that anything other than normal business under a 5 percent market share is illegal. We should be requiring unions. Then with the government itself, we get it out of our daily lives. Other than taxes and voting, it should not be something we interact with regularly. Armed police should not be a ubiquitous sight. We should be able to grow our own veggies without the government showing up to stop that.
There's so much we can do, that complete disengagement from the project of the state seems to me to be counter productive to actually helping people. In another example, one of the most powerful tools we have are Unions. But without government protection we know cooperations will do everything up to and including murdering their work force to prevent unionization. And yeah we can murder them right back. But there's always guns for money, so that's not a winning battle.