this post was submitted on 03 Jan 2025
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Yesterday, i had transit police and transit security at "centro plaza", via's main bus station in san antonio, ban me for 24 hours, physically push me, grab my wrist, and threaten to arrest me, for saying "fuck you" to them, and initially refusing to leave. They said profanity is prohibited, and that centro plaza is private property. They said it would be a felony if i hit back while being arrested.

Via is a government/state entity. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/VIA_Metropolitan_Transit

As far as i can tell, scotus has said airports are not public forums, but has not decided for bus stations.

I'm under the impression that "Wolin v. Port of New York Authority" would suggest that bus stations are traditional public forums, but that applies in the 2nd circuit, not in texas.

I'm a free speech absolutist. Scotus is not. But i believe even under current case precedent, that via transit police and transit security violated my rights to free speech by banning me from the plaza in response to "profanity", speech they didn't like, and eveything that followed on from that, including physically touching me.

What about travis park? Scotus has said that parks are traditional public forums. Travis park is both a park and a concentration of via bus stops. What about via bus shelters on the streets? Scotus has said streets are public forums. What if i wore a shirt that said "fuck the police", and tried to board a bus?

Any thoughts?

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[–] Death_Equity 6 points 2 days ago (1 children)

You are omitting the context under which you said what you said.

[–] [email protected] -2 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

I arrived at centro plaza needing to use the restroom, and then wanting to catch the number 76 bus westward. I headed for the restroom, and a group of about 4 or 5 transit police and security were standing directly in front of the restrooms. I had my ear buds in. As i arrived at the door, someone, i believe one of the cops, said the bathroom is closed. There was a cardboard sign on the left glass saying it was closed, but otherwise, it didn't look closed. I either tried opening the door, or more likely continued to approach the open door. I also removed my ear buds. The person inside was a via employee. If i remember right, he said it was closed, and then he extended the yellow partition that they usually use to block it off. I asked how long it would be closed. Someone, i believe the employee, said about 10 minutes. The cop said it would be closed until they were done, in a tone of voice i percieved as hostile. So i started walking off in the direction of the number 76 bus stop, muttering "fuck that and fuck you all". One of them asked what i said, so i stopped and said that i had said "fuck you". They said profanity is prohibited, and that this was private property. I argued with them for a minute or 2, saying that it was free speech under the first amendment. They told me to leave and not come back for 24 hours. They asked if i was taking a bus, and i said yes. One of the security said if i hit back while being arrested, it would be a felony. He pushed me several times, and grabbed my wrist once, but i twisted free. Eventually i walked off in the direction of martin street and leona, toward a different stop for number 76 upstream of the plaza. As i was walking off, one of them said to not take a bus, and one yelled to not come back for 24 hours. I continued to flip them off and yell "fuck you" as i left. I caught the number 3 westbound at martin and leona, which becomes the 76. I was on the bus when it stopped at centro, and i flipped them off from my seat, but i don't think they saw me. https://youtu.be/XLnnDUkZPW0

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 days ago

Ok, so you are just stupid.

First you ignored both the police, a sign, and only deal with the employee, then you immediately get damned rude and start whining about the situation.

You are not the winner you think you are.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 days ago

Stop bothering people who are just trying to get where they need to go.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago

The police aren't required to know the law, they just enforce what they believe the law to be. If that sounds like bullshit to you, well, it is. But the police in the US are bullshit anyway.

If you tell a cop "fuck you" then I wouldn't be surprised if they take it as an invitation to fuck you

I'm ignorant of the law in your jurisdiction. But I think you were wronged. I don't know that you actually have any recourse though, that would be a lawyer's domain

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Yesterday, i had transit police and transit security at "centro plaza", via's main bus station in san antonio, ban me for 24 hours, physically push me, grab my wrist, and threaten to arrest me, for saying "fuck you" to them, and initially refusing to leave.

I don’t know if the US has “disobey lawful order” laws or equivalent but that’s not covered by speech and I’d be surprised if they didn’t. Randomly swearing at people is not a great idea. If it’s private property they can ban you for whatever they like.

They said profanity is prohibited, and that centro plaza is private property.

Is the plaza not private property? I suspect you already have your answer. Regardless there’s a reason swearing at police in the US is dumb. They can just do you for disorderly conduct or they may constitute “fighting words” which is criminal conduct. As is swearing in front of minors. While people who own the plaza may not ban you for swearing per se they can and will ban you via existing avenues for doing so.

They said it would be a felony if i hit back while being arrested.

Resisting arrest or striking police (or people in general) is illegal and not protected by free speech.

What if i wore a shirt that said "fuck the police", and tried to board a bus?

As someone who’s is particularly critical of US policing this is just dumb. Even people who agree with the sentiment are likely to think so. Picking a fight with people who have fuck all accountability and have the legal power to fuck up your life is just not great in terms of life choices. Taking issue with the police is fine, engaging in criminal conduct to express that will only hurt you and likely make your life worse.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

Is the plaza not private property?

No, it is not private property. It is a public bus station, operated by via, which is funded by sales tax, and is run by a board of trustees appointed by the city and the county.

disorderly conduct or they may constitute “fighting words”

Disorderly conduct is not an exception to free speech. Fighting words are an exception, according to "Chaplinsky v. New Hampshire". But that atrocious decision has been significantly limited since, as summerized on wikipedia. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fighting_words

As is swearing in front of minors.

No, that isn't criminal.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

Ok, what did really happen?

Did you just walk up to a police officer, say "fuck you" and got kicked out?

I highly doubt it.

You say that you are a free speech absolutist, which just makes me think that you enjoy pissing other people off, and is using the free speech thing as a shield while being a dickhead.