this post was submitted on 04 Jul 2023
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Dota 2

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I started watching some dota matches, especially PGL, and players tend to pick from a really small group of heroes, like: storm spirit, techies, pugna etc

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[–] SenorMouse 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

The meta develops over time as the event goes on. Heroes like techies got a pretty significant buff with their E now providing an aoe stun. Heroes that didn't get any significant buffs but are showing up in the meta during the event are probably because they fill a role to counter something in the enemies draft. For example, even though storm has not been given any major buffs in 7.33, midlanders that dive the backline have been very popular at the moment and storm fills that role very well.

As the event goes on, the pool of heroes will get larger. Usually groups have less heroes picked than main stage historically I believe.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

There have actually been 104 out of 124 (84%) heroes picked in the Bali Major so far. If you only count those picked 10 times or more it's still 54/124 (44%).

Sure, it's not even close to a fully even representation, but still, it's not terrible. The last larger League of Legends tournament had 79 out of 163 (48%) picked at all, with 42/163 (28%) picked 4 times or more (less games in the tourney).

[–] catlover 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yeah that doesn't sound that bad. Maybe I just didn't watch enough to see more heroes picked

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

Yeah I mean the main ones were in every game, but there's always one or three or so non-meta ones sprinkled in. The human mind sees and focuses on patterns quite easily, while it's harder to see the ones not fitting it :)

[–] holiday 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

It's what is referred to as "the meta." As heroes get buffed, nerfed, changed, etc. the meta evolves. If Hero X and Hero Y are really good at doing something and Y gets a buff, maybe Y starts to get preferred. Now you know what was really bad vs X? Hero Z. Now hero Z's weaknesses aren't so obvious because Hero X just isn't strong enough to stand against all these heroes that are now being picked.

Eventually a couple months goes by and players have figured out the end of that X>Y>Z chain and a meta is born.

Now usually there are a few large tournaments each patch. During these tournaments we already know the strong heroes, but what about hero/team combinations? What about some cheese/pocket strat that a captain has cooked up? Sometimes certain players or teams just elevate a hero to broken status. It just works better than anywhere else. Well now the opponents have to decide "do i ban Y and Z and leave A in? Other team makes A just way too good, so ill leave Y and Z in play. Oh that worked really well, now how do I counter what else is being picked.

Eventually a new patch (more buffs, nerfs, changes) is released and everyone starts from 0 again. Sometimes (rarely) heroes get so overhauled they remove them from competitive play in order to get them somewhat balanced.

It's kind of late so I didn't do a great job explaining

[–] catlover 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Well it sounds like a good thing, to keep the game fresh, and to jazz things up a little. The only thing I don't like is when I watch tournaments I always see the same few heroes, and no variety of all :(

[–] holiday 1 points 1 year ago

Unfortunately just a symptom of the structure of the game. Some heroes are just too good right now. Undying and Shadow Demon come to mind. They have have great saves. Last patch almost across the board stun duration was lowered. I'm willing to bet the rise in popularity of a saving support is due to this change.

[–] angrymouse 1 points 1 year ago

There heroes that are really safe to pick but if you compare with league of legends, dota actually have a big pool on competitive scene. I just think that 7.33 is a bad patch and there is too much overturned heroes and too much bad ones.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago