this post was submitted on 27 Feb 2024
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Wtf. Had to reread the article like 3 times to figure out the mental gymnastics
So if consumers don't understand the labels, then how is banning only French producers from using them in France going to help? They still have to read the labels from other areas in Europe...do they think the French companies will make more money if consumers aren't confused? So they're trying to stifle imported goods? That's the only thing I can think of lol i can't make it make sense
There's no "thinking" happening. Only the convergence of two opposite things:
Now the politicians got their headlines so they're happy, and in practice almost nothing changes for the consumer so they're mostly happy. Ah and the veggie producers get fucked in the process, but the politicians don't care and the consumers don't know or care.
It's basically the dumb version of the current agricultural protests (the French farmers are pissed, among other things, that their products have to compete with "common EU market" products which were made using lots of cheap pesticides that would be illegal to use in France. Now to be fair it's not a 1-to-1 comparison because pesticide usage has profound health effects on local populations but you get the idea).
Either way to avoid unfair treatment of local producers, the government has to either deregulate the industry to match the lowest common EU denominator, or to successfully lobby the EU to raise the requirements everywhere. Or I guess just treat producers unfairly and hope they'll be able to compete anyway.
Thanks for the explanation!
Blocking this at European level requires a completely different path. I wouldn't be surprised if France tried to do so next, and it would probably get the support of other neighbouring countries that have similar values when it comes to food.
Not sure what's all the push against this from this thread though. Is it not okay to call a spade a spade?
What if we take the opposite approach and look at someone marketing a processed food based on tripe as as vegan friendly corn chunks?
I don't think "vegetarian steak" is a confusing term, especially not intentionally so. It aims to recreate some of the consistency/taste of steak. I also never personally witnessed them packaged in a way that was intentionally confusing: they are in a different isle/stand and use completely different containers (actual meat is in black polystyrene with transparent plastic, vegetarian alternatives are packaged in green polystyrene with a colorful label).
Now maybe my experience isn't fully representative, but I'd like proof of deceitful marketing happening before legislating this stuff. Right now what this looks like is culture war bullshit against a made-up problem.
It's not a made up problem, bit you are right it might slip I to the culture was bullshit department soon.
You not thinking that this is confusing is irrelevant, there are more people put there including oldies that don't bring their fucking glasses at the supermarket with them.
Point is that countries like France take seriously food mislabelling (in my opinion rightly so), this is nothing different that fake mozzarella, parmigiana or champagne. There are ways to prevent confusing customers, this law is one of them.
Have your marketing department go crazy with a catchy new name for your amazing plant based creation.
I'm going to assume this is good faith.
So lets talk about something different for a minute. Many people enjoy the taste of beer yes? but also alcohol is undeniably detramental to take as a drug. So people make stuff that is not beer, in the sense that it is not an alcoholic beverage, but is very similar. They call these products alcohol free beer. That's pretty descriptive right? it's going to taste like beer but it's not alcoholic.
So steak say, obviously it means a certain anatomical piece of the desecrated corpse of a cow. But also it's an experience, eating a steak. So if someone says "plant based steak" they're describing that experience. They're saying "hey this will have the texture and taste of something analogous to a lump of muscle from a corpse, but it's made of plants" with the name.
I don't see why this should be controversial, it's just shorthand. What would you suggest they call it?
Alcohol free beer is beer that was brewed as usual, then the alcohol got removed. Which is a very different thing than making a tart soda and calling it beer.
It's the same thing as "lactose-free milk" vs. "almond milk". One is produced by a cow (and an extra enzyme to split the lactose), the other by draining California's water table.
In fact in Germany one particular type of -- colloquially -- beer, Malzbier, (alcohol free) is not allowed to be sold as beer because it contains added sugar, which isn't allowed according to Germany's definition of beer. Otherwise it's actually brewed like beer, keeping the temperature such that the yeast doesn't produce alcohol.
LOL, asks for good faith and then go with desecrated corpse of a cow. I'll bite, ignore the fluff and go straight to the question
Don't fucking care. Your marketing department comes up with something catchy, descriptive and that doesn't confuse customers. And in this case in France, that doesn't break the law.
Piggybacking your comment about beer. I make a nice dry and sparkly wine that resembles Champagne but the grapes are not grown in the Champagne region.in fact its not a grape wine at all I use recycled shoe soles. I'd like to call it Champagne in the shops around Europe but if I am not allowed, what would you suggest i call it?
that's... what it is. meat doesn't grow on trees, you murder someone and take pieces of their corpse. you can say you think that's good and fine but you can't deny that's what happens.
Sure then lets call the meat substitutes that are the subject of this thread 'ultra processed foods', that are being mislabelled for genuine EU agricultural products by astute scammers
Go ahead, but be consistent and apply that label to oils, flour, sugar, starches, bread, and juices. They're literally just spices and gluten ground together.
You're a reactionary dumbarse using the status quo to argue for the status quo, which as I pointed out by inference would have us using the 13th century definitions if applied then. I guess you're a bit thick for that though so there it is explicitly. You nong.
I do that, I am very serious about my flours and breads. And so should you.
Status quo is not necessarily a bad thing. particularly if we are talking about things like food and places like France. It's called culture, my friend, some people and countries care about it.
as to the rest. If you called it shoe based champagne, and it tasted like champagne and you printed the nutritional information on it why would I care? protected regions are dumb and people that defend them are stupid.
LOL if you say so then we have settled this whole argument. Go ahead and let the France government know.
From other comments it sounds like you might be vegetarian or vegan. Would you like product to be mislabelled and contain products thatbyoubare not okay to eat, just because someone else thinks it doesn't matter and "vegan product" can be interpreted in many ways and it's stupid anyway?
Nobody is labelling plant based steak "cow steak (but not actually, it's gluten lol. Gotcha!)
How to tell me you're American without telling me you're American.
Do not sully the good name of the Peruvian people by implying I share a hemisphere with them.
It's just the standard intersection between domestic and EU law when it comes to food labelling.
E.g. if you want to sell stuff in Germany as beer that isn't beer according to German law then you can't brew it in Germany, it has to be imported and thus fall under common market rules.