this post was submitted on 09 Dec 2023
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Privacy
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This argument will have some weight if you can provide examples where telegram shared some information about private groups with someone unauthorized.
I'm not shilling. Just pointing out obvious differences in products' features that one has to take into account when judging about app developer's "wrongdoings".
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It is you who refuses to take logical steps to agree that every single app with the same feature set will be vulnerable to governments' decisions. Signal is not a subject of that only because it does not provide such features and therefore is not used by protesters.
Yes, telegram knows all your private groups. But you are missing everything by assuming it is bad for you. You will be arrested not because telegram will disclose your private groups. You will be arrested because some person will join your private group and leak your presence there. That person will not need to get any information from Telegram for that. This is not an issue a service could solve by any encryption.
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Could you prove that? More specifically, I need proof that it allows public groups for protesters to gain mass and protect their identifies adequately at all times.
It does need that. Signal stores this information too. Just because it's encrypted doesn't mean it will not be handled to someone against your will.
I don't know, maybe because I can't imagine why even the most insane government would come up with laws that would allow it to ask internet services something like "hey there is this person, please provide some data of their activity on your service" instead of just capturing that person and making them spill out everything themselves. If you are at the point where your groups are disclosed this won't be the result of government's requests to some service. It'll be the starting point for those.
I wouldn't.
Signal's way to "not have problems" is to avoid users who could bring them.
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And why should I accept your reframing when you try to compare signal to telegram?
I see, signal wants to keep its servers free from content. Cool. This automatically means groups can't accept new members and allow them seeing all the previously posted content. This is what protests use to grow. So signal can't be used to grow protest groups. Only fixed groups would use it to do stuff they want, and "making more people join the protest" would not be on list. They will need to resort to other methods to spread infornation if they wanted to grow. Protesters groups that don't want to grow are not what I could consider a real protest.
Protest is a public movement. It will not be effective when it's private or wants to keep its members anonymous. This is basically what oppressive governments are fine with, so signal helps them in a way.
What led to telegram's "wrongdoings" would not be possible if it did not provide public communication. Signal doesn't provide it either so they'd have to use a different platform. That would lead to the same consequences.
Affected people could use private groups in telegram to avoid issues. But then it would not be what they wanted, and their actions would not be impactful enough (without other platform capable of public communication) for government to get interested in them.
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Up until you allow to join that one member that will leak every single thing you wanted to keep private.
Not sure my English skill is enough to understand this sentence.
Who exactly gave anyone first class access to anything?
This is like saying that an email provider has access to your emails. Not even trying to argue with the rest of implications. So what? You're still avoiding the point. No service can protect you from the real world. You must avoid real world issues yourself. By either using private features of apps, or by not participating in public communication, or by using apps that prevent you from participating in public communication etc.
Someone cut a hand with a saw when cutting a board. You saw that and thought "that saw manufacturer is at fault, I'd better use a saw from another manufacturer". What's happening really is you choosing a knife over a saw. Also it's very probable that people like you are not ever going to try to cut a board. That's what choosing signal looks like to me. I'm not judging you for choosing a knife or for avoiding boards, but it's worth it to understand the differences.